I would assume the innovation here would need to be making it small and efficient for any meaningful torque output? Usually when you see claims of a 93% efficient electrical motor its the result of taking an absolute beast of a 2kW machine and operating it at 400W. Does anyone have insights into what Renault are doing here?
Electric motors with no rare earths
111–120 of 231 posts
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#112Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
It also helps that they are made from aluminum which doesn’t rust like iron does.
And epoxy binds to aluminum just fine ? Epoxy is weird. What solid material does it NOT bond to ?
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
It also helps that they are made from aluminum which doesn’t rust like iron does.
And epoxy binds to aluminum just fine ? Epoxy is weird. What solid material does it NOT bond to ?
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#115Earlier quoted context omitted.
Been there. Im gonna guess that 90% of HN folk have similar stories to tell.
The Cub Scouts in the 1960s were a lot of fun. Each den meeting involved a project. The other one I remember was we each built a kite from scratch. Mine was a bit fragile, and the first gust of wind shredded the sticks and plastic film. But it was still fun! As a teen I built a flame thrower. No, I'm not going to explain how to build one. My dad told me that God looks out for little boys, because otherwise they'd nev…
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
The bit the gets me more than the sale price is servicing. BMWs have a terrible record for needing expensive repairs. I know you shouldn’t rely on anecdote, but it seems I do.
The only way I would buy a BMW is if it were an EV. I’m just not brave (or rich) enough to buy their ICEs.
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#117Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#118Electrically excited synchronous machines (EESMs), also known as wound field synchronous machines (WFSMs) have a number of potential advantages and disadvantages compared to interior permanent magnet synchronous machines (IPMSMs). IPMSMs are the dominant motor topology currently in use for North American electric vehicles. Advantages: - Not subject to the price and supply chain volatility of rare earth permanent magn…
You can switch a motor without permanent magnets to "idle mode".
I understand in Tesla dual motor configurations, the front motor is without magnets. The excitation field will be turned on when you need extra power, but at crusing speed it does not cause extra "drag". From one teardown I've seen, they even went so far to use cheaper and less efficient IGBTs for the front drive, and more efficient SiC Mosfets for the rear motor (in the same vehicle!). If you need extra acceleration briefly, lower efficiency can be accepted.
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#119I own a Zoe for that reason
Re: Electric motors with no rare earths
#120The electrically excited synchronous motors have been known forever, but they had not been used in EVs because of 2 disadvantages.
The first is that traditional EESMs require brushes, i.e. sliding electrical contacts, which are worn out by friction, so such motors require frequent maintenance for changing the brushes.
It is possible to make brushless EESMs, but they require a rotating transformer and a semiconductor rectifier inside the rotor.
The second disadvantage is a lower efficiency than with permanent magnets, which cannot be improved so much as to match PM motors, because the electrical currents that circulate through the rotor windings must generate heat. The lower efficiency also makes cooling more difficult.
Renault says that their EESMs have an efficiency of 92%. This is a good efficiency, even if not as good as attainable with permanent magnets. Losing a few percents in efficiency is an acceptable compromise for avoiding the use of expensive and supply-constrained chemical elements.
What I wonder is whether Renault reaches this 92% efficiency with EESMs having brushes, or with brushless EESMs, and this is what I would have liked to read on the parent Web page.
Brushless EESMs usually had a lower efficiency, so 92% would be impressive for them, while it would look normal for EESMs with brushes.
If Renault has succeeded to make a brushless EESM (i.e. maintenance-free) with an efficiency of 92%, that is something worth to brag about. Otherwise, making a traditional EESM would not be great news, because everybody has avoided those because of the maintenance problem.