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Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

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Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every single one.

Do you’ve proof for that? On the other hand, AIPAC is out there for anyone to see

> Do you’ve proof for that?

Yes, it's why we require foreign agents to register [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Agents_Registration_Ac...

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#292
post #129
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was also a bad idea then. They could never have effected regime change. That’s a fantasy that Israel included in its pressure on the US, but which US intelligence deemed highly implausible. There was never a world where this was a good idea. We had a diplomatic agreement that worked, nuked it for no gain, and now there isn’t a viable way to influence Iran. Diplomacy can’t function again because they don’t trust th…

You might be right on the regime change being fantasy but those things are not predictable and we don't know the details. Where you're definitely wrong is on the "diplomatic agreement that worked". Iran continued to enrich violating the agreement, the agreement was time bound and not indefinite (and would have already expired anyways), and it enabled them to sell oil and raise a lot of money to fuel their wars, missi…

Since my other reply was flagged, and I'm past the edit window, and I learnt a little more about the nuance:

- Technically Iran was considered to be meeting the requirements of the JCPOA during the 2016-2018 period in reports issued at the time.

- Iran failed to declare all its sites and programs before entering the JCPOA. This is known now, after the fact.

- Technically some argue that because Iran participated in meetings and filed papers they met the PMD requirements which were the preliminary requirement for the JCPOA to take effect. The nuance here is whether they technically fulfilled the requirements despite lying and hiding and then "only" violated the NPT or whether they violated the PMD.

- That Iran hid sites, material and equipment came into light after the Mossad stole Iran's nuclear archive. This is fact and was confirmed by IAEA inspections despite Iran's attempts to prevent that.

- When the IAEA asked to inspect those sites Iran engaged in a cover up operation and delayed access. After the sites were inspected there was evidence of nuclear material made by human activities.

- That material discovered by IAEA was not farther enriched which the supporters of the agreement claim is evidence that Iran didn't enrich more material. In reality Iran lied and hid facilities and so despite the samples taken by the IAEA not finding evidence of more enrichment the basic fact is that Iran acted in bad faith and so we just don't know. Maybe they only hid sites, equipment, and nuclear material but did not pursue further enrichment during this period. Maybe they did in other sites.

- Officially Iran was never found to be in violation of the JCPOA.

- The JCPOA was set to expire in October 18, 2025 after which there would have been no restriction on Iran anyways. That's another part of the argument that this was a bad agreement.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#294
post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MAGA has split hard. it's now MIGA vs AF. With MIGA being mostly boomer evangelicals and AF being younger, either outright fuentes antisemites or just anti Zionists that lean right. There is a huge astroturfing campaign to make it seem like MAGA is unanimously pro netanyahu, but it's simply fake.

What is AF in this context?

"America First"

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#295
post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MAGA has split hard. it's now MIGA vs AF. With MIGA being mostly boomer evangelicals and AF being younger, either outright fuentes antisemites or just anti Zionists that lean right. There is a huge astroturfing campaign to make it seem like MAGA is unanimously pro netanyahu, but it's simply fake.

What is AF in this context?

America first

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The biggest mistake US & Israel did was underestimating Iran, specifically their defensive capabilities. They've prepared for this war for 47 years, _literally_ praying for it. You had Abbas Araghchi on TV literally inviting American army into Iran for a ground invasion. Iran would be highly unlikely to be able to prevent a ground invasion from the US since Iran's convention military capabilities are not particular…

> They can obviously cause a lot of damage but they would obviously lose that war if the US decided they had to remove the regime by force. That is far from obvious. A command structure scattered around a huge country should be able to outlast U.S. willingness to throw bodies into a shredder.

It’s easy to look at Ukraine for example. Since drones came into the picture it’s way harder to do a successful ground invasion. Russia has unimaginable losses and they still haven’t reached their strategic goal.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#297
post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, because different factions in the regime are at odds with eachother - there's MAGA, who are a sock puppet for whatever Netanyahu wants, and who spearheaded the idiotic war with Iran, and there's the entire military, which thinks that this war is by far the dumbest thing they've been asked to do... This year. Did this announcement come from the military side of things, or the MAGA side of things?

MAGA has split hard. it's now MIGA vs AF. With MIGA being mostly boomer evangelicals and AF being younger, either outright fuentes antisemites or just anti Zionists that lean right. There is a huge astroturfing campaign to make it seem like MAGA is unanimously pro netanyahu, but it's simply fake.

> MAGA has split hard

It's premature to say it has split. MAGA always had multiple factions, and Trump has historically been excellent at keeping them in line. (See: Arab Americans in Michigan voting for Trump.)

To the extent we're seeing any meanginful splits, it's in independents splitting from the GOP. Not MAGA splitting in any meangingful way. (Trump's recent primary wins show this.)

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#299
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That speaks to my comment (which was not sufficiently specified I guess) but it does not speak to “the USA spies on Israel” which is what I was replying to

Okay, but I don't think Kiriakou would explicitly admit if the US spied specifically on Israel. I think at most we get a indirect "confession" like Andrew Bustamante gave in some podcasts like here, where he answers to the question if the US spies on the Mossad that everybody spies on everybody and than distract to the case were the US was caught spying on (it's ally) Germany: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZklvHVs…

By all reports, the USA only has agreements not to spy on Five Eyes (plus secretly, Israel). Germany is not in that group. Ally has nothing to do with it.

And it sounds like you are setting up an untestable claim. Can’t help you there. Believe what you want.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm Iranian, now living in the west. Allow me to chime in.. So Iran doesn't have a central command, they've developed a mosaic system where the 30+ chains operate autonomously. It is also multi-layered (IRGC, Artesh, Basij, etc). The multi-layered design was developed after the revolution, when they realized that the regime should be protected in case of internal mutiny. IRGC specifically was put in place to protect…

> The biggest mistake US & Israel did was underestimating Iran, specifically their defensive capabilities. They've prepared for this war for 47 years, _literally_ praying for it. You had Abbas Araghchi on TV literally inviting American army into Iran for a ground invasion. Iran would be highly unlikely to be able to prevent a ground invasion from the US since Iran's convention military capabilities are not particular…

> they can obviously cause a lot of damage but they would obviously lose that war if the US decided they had to remove the regime by force

I'm genuinely sceptical of this. If America literally invaded Iran, there is a good chance Chinese production comes to back them up. At that point we're fighting with a long logistics chain on someone else's territory (giving them advantages of knowing the land, having local sympathies and having a greater reason to fight) while getting pelted by asymmetric-warfare tactics we can't meaningfully reciprocate.

> unfortunately this likely is going to end up resulting in a ground invasion being inevitable at some point

Why? Just remove their ability to destroy Israel. Keep taking out their nuclear programme from time to time and have the Congress ratify the JCPOA in case they come back to the table.

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