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Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

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Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#151

Post by YZF »

throwaway534634 wrote: post #134
YZF wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be right on the regime change being fantasy but those things are not predictable and we don't know the details. Where you're definitely wrong is on the "diplomatic agreement that worked". Iran continued to enrich violating the agreement, the agreement was time bound and not indefinite (and would have already expired anyways), and it enabled them to sell oil and raise a lot of money to fuel their wars, missi…

> Where you're definitely wrong is on the "diplomatic agreement that worked". Iran continued to enrich violating the agreement... No, actually it is you who is wrong. Iran absolutely complied with the JCPOA. It is after US withdrew from the agreement that they pursued enrichment further.

[flagged]

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#152

Post by screye »

petcat wrote: post #49
basilgohar wrote: post #31

"Government suddenly and confusingly starts acting accordingly to what everyone's already know for a long time." This is really quite scary when you think about it. Why now all of a sudden?

USA almost certainly spies on Israel (and everyone else) far deeper than anyone spies on them.

It's hilarious listening to CIA insiders talk about spying.

John Kiriakou [1] will spend 3 hours talking about the CIA's torture program (illegal) and NSA spying on Americans (illegal). In the same conversation, he will insist that the US would never spy on Israel because it is illegal.

Who is this fooling ?

[1] Senior ex-CIA official, whistleblower & internet meme phenomenon.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#153

Post by ma2kx »

hammock wrote: post #118
ma2kx wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kiriakou also stated several times that the Mossad was known to casually try to recruit CIA agents: https://youtu.be/R7OWqAgGzwA?t=163

That speaks to my comment (which was not sufficiently specified I guess) but it does not speak to “the USA spies on Israel” which is what I was replying to

Okay, but I don't think Kiriakou would explicitly admit if the US spied specifically on Israel.

I think at most we get a indirect "confession" like Andrew Bustamante gave in some podcasts like here, where he answers to the question if the US spies on the Mossad that everybody spies on everybody and than distract to the case were the US was caught spying on (it's ally) Germany: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZklvHVsaT4

PS: I guess at the end you didn't spy until you were caught spying.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#154

Post by karp773 »

yde_java wrote: post #38
MilnerRoute wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UPDATED COMMENT: Wikipedia says the 1967 attack on the U.S.S. Liberty was "a mistake due to Israeli confusion about the ship's identity," according to both U.S. and Israeli governments. (Though they also note people who question that conclusion...) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

Might be an attempt to correct history after the bad fact. There are huge budgets nowadays set up to correct public opinion, e.g. https://www.timesofisrael.com/foreign-ministry-to-receive-ma... Edit: a more recent article mentions a budget of $730M: https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-just-quintupled-its-pr-...

Despite the budget, that is clearly one thing where Israel has fallen behind its adversaries.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#155

Post by opsnooperfax »

hammock wrote: post #63
petcat wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA almost certainly spies on Israel (and everyone else) far deeper than anyone spies on them.

Since the 1951 Angleton-Harel Secret Pact, there has been an unwritten agreement that CIA and Mossad will not spy on each others countries. Kiriakou (who is a wonk) confirmed as much in recent remarks. But no one without at least a TS really knows

I think he said in that interview that the CIA does not spy on Israel. It does not apply the other way around. Based on policy decisions, this seems very believable to me.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#156

Post by StriverGuy »

parthdesai wrote: post #75
paulsutter wrote: post #23

The Snowden disclosures revealed that the US was regularly spying on Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Japan, South Korea, Brazil, Mexico, the EU, and the UN. Also of course the CIA was spying on Congress. One can only imagine that many of these countries were also spying on us in various capacities, albeit with fewer resources. Israel is a bigger concern because they're extremely good at it, but I'm sure it's nothing n…

How many of those countries openly lobby politicians in USA though?

Every single one.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#157

Post by Cyph0n »

ceejayoz wrote: post #117
Cyph0n wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to see an agreement on the supposed number of (unarmed) civilians killed. Over the course of the past few months, I have heard claims of thousands up to 50k. You would think the traffic and surveillance cams hacked by the Israelis would’ve shown the extent of this bloodbath. https://apnews.com/article/iran-war-security-cameras-surveil...

No one’s putting a public traffic cam in the regime’s secret detention sites.

Ah, so now none of the protesters were gunned down in the streets? How convenient.

> As many as 30,000 people could have been killed in the streets of Iran on Jan. 8 and 9 alone, two senior officials of the country’s Ministry of Health told TIME—indicating a dramatic surge in the death toll.

https://time.com/7357635/more-than-30000-killed-in-iran-say-...

Imagine infiltrating the Iranian surveillance camera network and being unable to produce footage of 30k people massacred across two days.

I do not like Iran because of its actions in Syria and Yemen, but even with my bias, I could hear the bullshit Western elitist consent manufacturing engine starting up from miles away.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#158

Post by 1209457 »

krona wrote: post #116
rag_wlk wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One reason is that blaming Israel for the Iran FUBAR situation is very convenient, especially for keeping MAGA on board. The right wing pundits are already working overtime on X and elsewhere to blame Israel and concoct all sorts of explanations why Trump authorized the strike (the most amusing is that he "was possessed by demons"). Blaming Israel may have been coordinated with Netanyahu, who has nothing to lose and…

> One reason is that blaming Israel for the Iran FUBAR situation is very convenient, especially for keeping MAGA on board. Polling shows support for Israel is far greater among Trump loyalist voters than non-loyalist Republicans, so this is surely false. Perhaps you're confusing "MAGA" with actual American nationalists, who are statistically irrelevant.

Support for Israel is present in the entire establishment, Democrat or Republican. Whenever Israel goes too far, a president suddenly leaks Netanyahu criticism like Biden on the hot mic where he said that he'd tell Netanyahu to have a "come to Jesus" moment or Trump leaking that he shouted at Netanyahu during a phone call.

This admin is special in that it blames proxies for wars that it started or provoked. Biden owned the Ukraine war, Trump blames the EU for wanting to continue the Ukraine war while Anduril and Eric Schmidt (https://www.techradar.com/pro/ex-google-ceo-is-key-to-ukrain...) are selling and testing their new drone tech.

In the case of Israel, you can say that there is direct influence from Kushner, Witkoff and Mark Levin. We'll see if Congress and Senate will get a 2/3rd majority to stop the war agaist a potential Trump veto. I don't think so. Until they do, I consider all resolutions with a simple majority to be theater for the midterm elections.

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#159

Post by godelski »

basilgohar wrote: post #31

"Government suddenly and confusingly starts acting accordingly to what everyone's already know for a long time." This is really quite scary when you think about it. Why now all of a sudden?

  > Why now all of a sudden?
The government already considered them a threat. Just like everyone else, including themselves (the gov isn't a single entity).

What changed is geopolitics. Official and publicly calling them a threat.

What this also changes is how gov works with companies. How these companies can subcontract and to who. Which, let's be honest, most companies don't give a rats ass if they are hacked. Sure, they lose money, but it's almost always a slap on the wrist and since every company works this way there's no market signal to express that you care even if you do. (I'd still encourage people to install apps like Signal, degoogle, and all that. Your individual choices still do matter, even if it's only us nerds)

Re: Pentagon raised threat of Israeli spying on U.S. to highest level, sources say

#160

Post by [deleted] »

shevy-java wrote: post #145
delecti wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe this is a bit glib, but it's because attacking Iran (which everyone knew was a bad idea but which presumably seemed useful as a distraction) turned out to be a bad idea. So the administration is taking it out on Israel, who wanted us to do it.

> So the administration is taking it out on Israel, who wanted us to do it. Well, it is clear to see that this is Netanyahu's ploy, but the thing is that Trump constantly lies about this. "There are negotiations", but then the US bombs again. To me it seems as if Trump operates in a way that makes it impossible to have anything else but drop bombs onto Iran. In this way he resembles Putin, who tries to occupy more an…

[deleted]
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