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GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

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Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#241

Post by hparadiz »

mattlondon wrote: post #219
hparadiz wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I think you have your numbers backwards regarding health. The US spends more (16% Vs 10 GDP), but preventable mortality, life expectancy, people living with chronic conditions etc are all worse than other developed nations: https://sites.lsa.umich.edu/mje/2023/05/26/a-comparative-ana... Plus the risk of being a victim of violence is higher in the US - you are 400% to 600% more likely to be murdered in the US than the…

Why do people on HN throw these stats out comparing poor people to poor people? We are all tech workers on HN. I'm not living in Alabama. When I compare my living situation I'm comparing my premium healthcare in Los Angeles to whatever the fuck you guys are doing.

Pretty much all those stats are irrelevant.

Seriously 62k? Try 3.5 times that and then you're in the ballpark. My healthcare expenses for the past few years have been less than 2% of my salary.

Y'all don't realize just how intensily our poor rural areas bring down the average while our HCOL areas tend to set the world wide standard you're trying to catch up to.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#242

Post by flumpcakes »

trumpdong wrote: post #212
ben_w wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UK has (for now) the Human Rights Act and is a (for now) subject to the jurisdiction of (by being a founding member of) the European Court of Human Rights. Which is not to excuse the errors, but to put it in context: it is a European country… albeit just like Turkey and Azerbaijan.

In the UK I'd be worried about being arbitrarily arrested, deported, and banned from re-entry. In the US I'd be worried about being murdered. By police. In cold blood.

> In the UK I'd be worried about being arbitrarily arrested, deported, and banned from re-entry.

That's not going to happen unless you commit a serious crime, in which case it's not arbitrary. I can't think of a single case that's made the news.

Meanwhile across the pond in America you have the nightly news reporting on children and people in cages screaming. People being rounded up for not being white. Little to no due process at all until you've been through 6 rounds of hell.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#243

Post by rafram »

bborud wrote: post #130
Cider9986 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, police can simply ask anyone for their passwords and if you don't give it up they can put you in jail. I won't be visiting. Despite many flaws, the US has some damn good rights for its citizens compared to the rest of the world.

You are aware of the fact that you essentially have no rights at border crossings, right? Even if you are a US citizen entering the US. This is why many companies have procedures for when employees visit certain countries, including the US. For instance that you are not allowed to bring your personal phone, your personal and work laptop or any medium that can hold sensitive or proprietary information.

> Even if you are a US citizen entering the US.

Is this really the case? As far as I understand it, US citizens have an absolute right to enter the country. So they can sit you in a room and ask you questions all afternoon, but eventually they have to let you in.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#244

Post by hparadiz »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #230
hparadiz wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea cause we throw more money at it. Our facilities are far superior. In California where I live though folks with little money get very subsidized healthcare that is cheaper than NHS taxes.

California may well be an outlier state in this and various other aspects.

You should check out the stats broken down by ethnicity and household wealth. That gives you a clearer picture of what a typical person on HN actually experiences.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#245

Post by iamkrazy »

paulgdp wrote: post #100
Cider9986 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, police can simply ask anyone for their passwords and if you don't give it up they can put you in jail. I won't be visiting. Despite many flaws, the US has some damn good rights for its citizens compared to the rest of the world.

> Yep, police can simply ask anyone for their passwords and if you don't give it up they can put you in jail. This is precisely the reason why I don't want to visit the US at the moment. The USA immigration officers can ask me to forfeit my phone's password and look at all my photos, documents, messages, call logs etc, WITHOUT SUSPICION. Some of that data can even stay on their servers for decades, and who knows if i…

At least you can walk in with a phone reset to factory settings, and once you cross the border restore from the cloud (or home server like me). In UK you can be stopped walking on the sidewalk. It's much more dystopian in UK.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#246

Post by guax »

Cider9986 wrote: post #36
antiloper wrote: post #31

OI mate, you got a loicense for that operating system? The only surprising thing about this story is that the user didn't get a visit by the police to be charged with a "non-crime cybersecurity incident". The UK has become such a shithole.

Yep, police can simply ask anyone for their passwords and if you don't give it up they can put you in jail. I won't be visiting. Despite many flaws, the US has some damn good rights for its citizens compared to the rest of the world.

Just to clarify this piece of misinformation.

The police can ask for your passwords. You're not required to give them anything until they apply for a Section 49 notice of RIPA. Which they must get from a Judge.

It seems to be recommended to refuse giving them the password before that notice is issued and seek a lawyer before complying.

If the judge agrees with them, you have to comply.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#247

Post by somewhatgoated »

josephg wrote: post #146
shevy-java wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, but the UK is in many ways words. At the least in the USA, often the constitution is upheld (give or take); in the UK you often don't even have such fundamental rights. The UK at present fits more to Russia than, e. g. European countries.

> At the least in the USA, often the constitution is upheld Some of ICE’s detainees may have different opinions on that point. The UK may endow her citizens with fewer rights. But I have a lot more trust in British due process. British civil servants seem much less … capricious than Americans. I was almost denied entry to Hawaii once because I told the CBP agent I didn’t have any cash on me. (My money is in a bank ac…

I had the same experience visiting the US - this was 15 years ago so I imagine it’s much worse now.

Got subjected to hour long questioning because I only had a little cash on me and told them truthfully that I would travel the country so I didn’t have one place to stay for the entirety of the trip (because I was TRAVELLING).

I since learned that my first mistake was to tell them the truth but alas.

After asking me about every single detail of my life they eventually let me in.

It’s a pity, such a great country being ruined by kleptocrats.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#248

Post by rafram »

seviu wrote: post #206
bborud wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are aware of the fact that you essentially have no rights at border crossings, right? Even if you are a US citizen entering the US. This is why many companies have procedures for when employees visit certain countries, including the US. For instance that you are not allowed to bring your personal phone, your personal and work laptop or any medium that can hold sensitive or proprietary information.

Not sure if related but this is my story. I am Spanish. When leaving SF back to Europe from a Google IO, after control, waiting to scan my luggage, an officer stood besides me and started speaking in Spanish besides me. The first minute my brain didn’t register because though Spanish is my mother tongue, I guess it was not ready for that. The police officer started to get irritated. Eventually my brain switched, I ha…

This seems very innocuous? Almost a third of Californians speak Spanish natively.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#249

Post by defrost »

hparadiz wrote: post #241
mattlondon wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you have your numbers backwards regarding health. The US spends more (16% Vs 10 GDP), but preventable mortality, life expectancy, people living with chronic conditions etc are all worse than other developed nations: https://sites.lsa.umich.edu/mje/2023/05/26/a-comparative-ana... Plus the risk of being a victim of violence is higher in the US - you are 400% to 600% more likely to be murdered in the US than the…

Why do people on HN throw these stats out comparing poor people to poor people? We are all tech workers on HN. I'm not living in Alabama. When I compare my living situation I'm comparing my premium healthcare in Los Angeles to whatever the fuck you guys are doing. Pretty much all those stats are irrelevant. Seriously 62k? Try 3.5 times that and then you're in the ballpark. My healthcare expenses for the past few year…

Obviously, to the meanest intellect at least, it is because they are comparing an entire country to an entire country and not a few privileged here to a couple of elites there.

Re: GrapheneOS user reported to authorities for using GrapheneOS

#250

Post by dijit »

rvnx wrote: post #234
IshKebab wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not practical in many cases. I'm starting a new job soon and have to visit the US. No way am I saying no to that (way too good a job). I'll probably just buy a decoy phone for the border.

[flagged]

thought the culture was “free speech”

if you’re denied at the border for expressing speech online at some historic point (non-violent) then how can “respecting the culture” work?

When I am in Saudi Arabia, I don’t wear shorts out of respect for their culture; but they don’t go through my instagram looking for pictures of me in shorts.

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