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C++: The Documentary

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Re: C++: The Documentary

#221

Post by jdw64 »

justin66 wrote: post #137
jdw64 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are so many standards and idioms that it gets confusing. There are still legacy codebases out there — some codebase still use C++98 as their standard, others use C++11... And with Unreal Engine, the modern C++ standard is C++14, right? There are things like smart pointers, but some places don't even use them. I feel like there are just too many features. When I saw template metaprogramming — that new feature —…

> And with Unreal Engine, the modern C++ standard is C++14, right? Unreal Engine depends on C++20 at this point. https://dev.epicgames.com/documentation/unreal-engine/epic-c...

When I went on a business trip for screen golf program project back then, it was UE4(CPP14), By your introduction UE5 onward, it's 20. I've updated my knowledge.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#222

Post by gverrilla »

garyrob wrote: post #211

For what it's worth: I had an idea for a special reminder app I wanted for myself. It's complicated enough that it comes to 9,000+ lines of code. I wanted to write it using the C++ UI library wxWidgets, because I like that wxWidgets uses native widgets, and is cross-platform, and that it's easy to make an app look nice. And that it doesn't use tons of memory. There's a wxPython library, but I didn't want my UI to be…

Hey I'm curious on how your reminder app works and to what effects, if you're willing to share. I'm on iteration 3 already of my reminder app, also vibe coded, and it helps me a lot. My first one was inspired on Remind [0].

0: https://dianne.skoll.ca/projects/remind/

Re: C++: The Documentary

#223

Post by socalgal2 »

C++ needs to die. I get so many people are invested in it and so much code is written in it. I used to be a fan and it's still my main job. But, in 2026 with LLMs able to find all the exploits, and with more and more adversarials, we need a language that is opt-out of safety, not C++ which is opt-in + super vigilance to get safety. It doesn't work and decades of experience proves it.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#225

Post by jason_oster »

bluGill wrote: post #119
imtringued wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those asserts probably saved a lot of development costs and increased the robustness of the software, which is worth a lot more than a few percent on a benchmark. I personally am more conservative on those things. I'll pick the fastest thing that is reliable.

Are we talking about games or medical devices here? I expect different things from them. If a medical device needs to turn off bounds checking to get results I'm concerned enough to not want to let anyone use it. If a game can get a slight performance improvement I'm all for it, who cares if it crashes, it is just a game.

Screw this game! I lost all of my progress because it crashed and the last auto-save is 10 minutes old. Uninstalled. 0 stars. Getting a refund.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#226

Post by Matheus28 »

socalgal2 wrote: post #223

C++ needs to die. I get so many people are invested in it and so much code is written in it. I used to be a fan and it's still my main job. But, in 2026 with LLMs able to find all the exploits, and with more and more adversarials, we need a language that is opt-out of safety, not C++ which is opt-in + super vigilance to get safety. It doesn't work and decades of experience proves it.

And replace it with what?

Re: C++: The Documentary

#228

Post by bayindirh »

poncho_romero wrote: post #216
techbrovanguard wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> C is an abstraction of the machine, so thin it's nearly transparent. Looks like someone fell for the C abstract machine trap yet again. No, C is isn’t an abstraction of the machine.

C Is Not a Low-level Language: Your computer is not a fast PDP-11. https://spawn-queue.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3212477.3212479

As a corollary, all processors are C VMs, anyway.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#229

Post by WalterBright »

mirmor23 wrote: post #144

Ken Thompson's criticism of C++ as incoherent, complex and garbage heap of ideas still resonates with me; C++98 was the last version I used for work although I've dabbled in 11/17/20 out of curiosity. IMO, if c++/cfront didn't ride on the tails of c, I'm skeptical it would've seen widespread use, but then, that's its main identity which limited it in ways that C++ was not willing to change; It is highly irritating to…

> if c++/cfront didn't ride on the tails of c, I'm skeptical it would've seen widespread use

What launched C++ into success was Zortech C++. At the time, 90% of programming was done on MS-DOS. Cfront was nearly unusable on DOS, because:

1. agonizingly slow to compile

2. no support for near/far pointers, which was essential for non-trivial apps

Zortech C++ fixed those problems, and sold like wildfire. This provided critical mass for C++ to succeed. The traffic on comp.lang.c++ angled sharply upward. Borland saw our sales, and abandoned their OOP language product and did Turbo C++ instead. Microsoft saw Borland's success and then did their own C++.

We sold a lot of Zortech C++ compilers to Microsoft. They used it to develop COM.

I heard rumors that Microsoft was developing their own OOP C, called C*. I've never been able to confirm it, though.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#230

Post by jmalicki »

jeffbee wrote: post #214
jmalicki wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just adds to the incoherency. It's why I've found Rust a joy - enough had happened in programming languages, that it was able to reinvent C++ with some of the best parts of the Haskell/ML/Scala family, some of the ergonomics of Python/nodejs, and bringing the borrow checker too. C++ is this weird amalgam of like 7 different generations of languages. But by far the worst part is the developer hostility behind the…

Saying this about Rust and C++ is like saying the kitchen you just built is cleaner than the old kitchen you used for 50 years. Get back to me in another few years.

Then I will feel the same about Rust! There's nothing wrong with wanting to throw out the janky accretion every 30 years for a redesign.

After 3-4 years, sure. But eventually enough has changed it's worth redoing.

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