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U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

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Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#431

Post by BobaFloutist »

port11 wrote: post #288
benzible wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't assume that this is about cost cutting. If the goal were saving money, the cheapest option by far would be to leave the hardware in the water and just stop funding the monitoring. Instead the plan is an expensive operation to send ships out to extract 900+ instruments from under two miles of ocean. It's clear that this is driven by performative climate denialism and a pro fossil fuel stance. The Trump admi…

But… why? Climate change is very much real and even stubborn deep-right voters like my father now ‘believe’ in it. Ok, some people make some cash. But wouldn’t they anyway? I don’t understand this need to keep pandering to a minority and to destroy ecosystems.

People are going to give you all sorts of answers that are based on strategy or negotiation or interests, but I think it basically all boils down to "to own the libs." We have to remember that before this all started, he was registered as a Democrat. He doesn't (or didn't) give a shit about any of this, but people that said no to him do, so he's going to do his level best to break it all. It's just spite, and glee at being able to make people bewildered, angry, and sad. That's all so much of this is.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#432

Post by dotancohen »

anonymars wrote: post #377
dotancohen wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> last time I recall by taliban sheepherders Part of the reason that Americans prefer to lose that war is because the enemy is called "sheepherders", implying innocent civilians, when the military is winning. The blurring of when a militant is referred to as a civilian has proven to be a very effective tactic to reduce the American population's tolerance for war.

I'm confused, are you insinuating that the Taliban essentially ran a PR campaign to portray themselves as sheepherders to garner sympathy from the US population to reduce its appetite for fighting them?

No, I am stating that there are strong elements in popular media, news providers chief among them, who seek to weaken US influence and use US public opinion to drive that change.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#433

Post by dotancohen »

sofixa wrote: post #359
dotancohen wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US military deterrence has been a paper tiger ever since Biden told Iran "don't" [1], and Iran did, and Biden did not respond. Now whoever the sitting US president would be - Trump or anybody else - must restore that deterrence. There is no nice or easy way to do that. The last time the US had to do that was during WW2 and the enemies were not floating heavy, extended media campaigns and funding US universities at th…

The reason why Iran was even back in the nuclear game was because a moron pulled out of the JCPOA that was giving them concrete steps and carrots to get them to stop.

The JCPOA agreements were set to expire in January 2026 - and then Iran could continue their nuclear ambitions. The only people who could support those agreements either:

1. Didn't read them and know that they expire in 10 years.

2. Think that 10 years is a long enough time in the future where whatever happens then doesn't matter to their current goals.

3. Would like to see a nuclear-capable Iran.

For what it's worth, January 2026 already passed 5 months ago.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#434

Post by dotancohen »

sofixa wrote: post #397
cmxch wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Not at all. Iran was rewarded with progressive sanction relief and progressive unblocking of their own money that was seized decades ago, as long as they continued cooperating.

They only had to cooperate until January 2026, then they were free to carry on with their nuclear ambitions.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#435

Post by ElevenLathe »

port11 wrote: post #288
benzible wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't assume that this is about cost cutting. If the goal were saving money, the cheapest option by far would be to leave the hardware in the water and just stop funding the monitoring. Instead the plan is an expensive operation to send ships out to extract 900+ instruments from under two miles of ocean. It's clear that this is driven by performative climate denialism and a pro fossil fuel stance. The Trump admi…

But… why? Climate change is very much real and even stubborn deep-right voters like my father now ‘believe’ in it. Ok, some people make some cash. But wouldn’t they anyway? I don’t understand this need to keep pandering to a minority and to destroy ecosystems.

Your father believes it because, presumably, he is not paid to deny it, like the president and his lackeys are.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#436

Post by sofixa »

dotancohen wrote: post #433
sofixa wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason why Iran was even back in the nuclear game was because a moron pulled out of the JCPOA that was giving them concrete steps and carrots to get them to stop.

The JCPOA agreements were set to expire in January 2026 - and then Iran could continue their nuclear ambitions. The only people who could support those agreements either: 1. Didn't read them and know that they expire in 10 years. 2. Think that 10 years is a long enough time in the future where whatever happens then doesn't matter to their current goals. 3. Would like to see a nuclear-capable Iran. For what it's worth…

Or alternatively, in 2026 Iran would have been hooked on closer economic cooperation and trade, (relative) reformers would be in power, and the deal would have been renewed. Yanking the deal all but guaranteed that the hardliners would go back in charge, because they were proven right - the US could not be trusted to keep its word, so negotiations don't matter, the only thing that would actually protect them is nuclear weapons.

> Would like to see a nuclear-capable Iran.

Postponing their nuclear programme with at least 10 years is absolutely worth doing. Because realistically you cannot, I repeat, cannot force them to stop it. If the regime wants to continue, it will and their facilities deep under the mountains are impenetrable.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#437

Post by cryptopian »

rdedev wrote: post #25

I wish I could find it but Simon Clark, someone who specialized in climate science, had put out a video about how we were only recently able to model the AMOC and it's shifting patterns thanks to this measurement we were doing Edit: probably not this one but atleast tells us why measurement is needed https://youtube.com/shorts/-X5EhUbzLTY?si=_N92PNUiTi3STat6

I've become a big fan of Simon lately. It's difficult to make videos about such a serious and all-encompassing topic without either falling into some combination of doomerism, misinformation, or apathy. He's got a real talent for bringing his expertise to a general audience, and I always come away from a video being clear about what the problem is he's talking about, why it matters but importantly how we deal with it (and how I can deal with it personally, without falling into the "only individual actions matter" trap)

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#438

Post by nancyminusone »

lostmsu wrote: post #408
nancyminusone wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He did not tell anyone to do these things nor do I claim he did. He did ask his staff to "look into" whether either of these sanitation methods "could be used inside the human body", which is a bit like if I asked my doctor if I could eat laundry soap and shampoo instead of showering and doing laundry. The very fact that these ideas exist inside a US president's skull is VERY SAD. THANK YOU FOR YOUR ATTENTION TO THIS…

Again, no quotes. But even as-is the idea of using ultraviolet to disinfect internal surfaces is not bonkers to any degree. Like I could see it working for nasal disinfection. In fact that's so obvious, that given you get very sad that someone else could even consider that tells me that you don't really know what you are talking about. Ironically, unlike Trump. Won't comment on the bleach one without a quote though.

have a read for yourself:

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/briefings-statements/re...

As for me, I don't think you need a phd to read the warning stickers on bleach and isoproponal which say "do not injest" [2] [3] or warnings on germicidal lamps that say "do not expose to eyes or skin" [4]. If you do or have otherwise hidden knowledge why these should be ignored, say so.

[2] https://www.thecloroxcompany.com/wp-content/uploads/cloroxre...

[3] https://www.fishersci.com/store/msds?partNumber=AC423830040&...

[4] https://www.mscdirect.com/knowledge-center/articles/safety-t...

Next you will tell me that he isnt talking about UVC lamps, and I'll have to admit he speaks so vaguely that you can interpert his own words as almost anything.

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#439

Post by emodendroket »

ars wrote: post #57
emodendroket wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't really seem relevant, nor does it seem credible that only Democrats are ever tempted to use trickery to make crime rates seem better than they are.

https://abc7news.com/post/report-finds-lack-police-efficienc... https://abc7.com/post/george-gascon-los-angeles-district-att...

I live here! Could you have tried to at least find stories that supported your claim?

Re: U.S. to dismantle system tracking Atlantic currents that are at risk of collapse

#440

Post by mring33621 »

holgerschurig wrote: post #366
intended wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America had scientific hegemony and political influence over its allies. All of tech traces its roots to American academia. American tech enthralls more of humanity than American military has ever fought.

Nah, I'd say that common "americans" (really: US citizens) are perhaps a bit on the dumber site. Not only confuse they constantly a continent (America) with a country (USA), they also have no idea about history. Or logics. You wrote "ALL of tech" ... no lets check. Cars - Germany (Gottlieb Daimler, but he didn't patent it), Germany (Carl Benz which made the first patent). Motorbikes - Germany (Gottlieb Daimler) Train…

A beautiful comment! Thank you!
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