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Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

newyorker.com

71–80 of 159 posts

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#71
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using unlicensed intellectual property to build a plagiarism machine that is wrong 10% of the time, could be interpreted as a scam by many folks.

That sentence could easily be applied to the human baseline.

Yes, if you're equating same rights to soulless corporations and humans as well as their motives.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#72
post #47

"When elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers." There's really nobody for normal people to root for in this battle. They're fighting over who gets to wield the dick that is going to screw us all.

While I have a great deal of sympathy for this point of view, I think the article makes an interesting observation that suggests it actually doesn't matter whether these people are intentionally trying to screw everybody or not--the actual problem is much bigger even than that: To claim that OpenAI’s mission of cultivating beneficial A.I. was compromised by Sam Altman is to let the entire industry off the hook. Yes,…

It’s ridiculous to accuse someone of having a “somewhat loose relationship with the truth” when Elon Musk is sitting right across from him, accusing him of dishonest behavior.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#73
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn't illegal so there is some reason why the USA allowed it. And as mentioned, they agreeed that they will not get the capital openai needs, so what did the USA people loose? A company which whouldn't have been able to do what they are known for anyway. Again i'm not protecting the rich, i just don't think there is a real scandal and its not the same as the other 2 the newyorker mentioned

Their stated non-profit goal was to benefit all of humanity. Changing OpenAI to benefit their financial backers in a formal sense could be a loss of nearly unbounded value.

Which is probably why they created another, for-profit, entity.

You can argue that it's unlikely the for-profit conservatorship of the non-profit is incompatible with that goal, but legally that becomes very much grey area.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#75

"When elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers." There's really nobody for normal people to root for in this battle. They're fighting over who gets to wield the dick that is going to screw us all.

> There's really nobody for normal people to root for in this battle. I believe the reports that Sam Altman is an egomaniacal liar. But I haven't been privy to any of it other than seeing him hype his company's tech in a clearly dishonest manner. That's not great. I've seen Elon be an active piece of shit, white nationalist, conspiracy promoter, etc, for years. I don't root for Sam Altman. I root against Elon. In a d…

You don't have to root for or against anyone in this fight. It's perfectly valid to oppose both actors and both outcomes, and the stakes of the fight.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#76

"When elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers." There's really nobody for normal people to root for in this battle. They're fighting over who gets to wield the dick that is going to screw us all.

I think Elon had the moral high ground in principle, but him waiting so long makes me think it was never about the moral high ground to begin with.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think parent probably means winning on merit or a sense of justice. As in won for a deserved reason rather than a technicality. The technicality here is exceeded the statute of limitations. A win in any manner isn’t landing the same for observers as winning for a just reason.

There is no "sense of justice" that will sway an appeal, it's all about the law. And this jury just found that there was zero merit under law. Appeals are for finding legal technicalities or edge cases. They do not overturn findings of fact from a jury. That is, it used to be that way in the US, when the courts were ruled by law. In the modern US, the Supreme Court is a partisan political body, so perhaps people are…

I'm clarifying and drawing the distinction related to the following because the responder wasn't responding to what was meant, but what they heard: > Sam didn't "win" the case in the sense that most people will think of when reading this headline.

There are 2 senses of "win" here. You're talking about the "win" (A) where it is achieving victory regardless of reason.

The second type of "win" (B) that is being called out in quotes is one based either on the merits of the law (verses a technicality) or a sense of justice.

I'm not highlight the first sense of win (A) which parent of my comment and you seem to be talking about I'm pointing out grandparent is talking about (B).

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#78
post #19

This is a weird fantasy among the literati that AI is a "scam", that we can "expose" them with lots of palace intrigue coverage and SBF or Elizabeth Holmes them away and then everything will be right in the world. Some of the best models are Chinese and Open-source and so-so good and Sam Altman is wholly irrelevant to them. Some folks are in for a very rude awakening.

Using unlicensed intellectual property to build a plagiarism machine that is wrong 10% of the time, could be interpreted as a scam by many folks.

> wrong 10% of the time

that doesn't sound nearly as bad as you think it does; I don't see how ethics are relevant here either, unless oil is also somehow a scam

regardless, one must be delusional to deny the fact that it's useful tech

"but they're evil" is not an argument

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#79
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s nowhere near AGI, and LLMs are not going to lead to it either. They do seem to be good at fooling people though.

> nowhere near AGI, and LLMs are not going to lead to it either. Nevermind what they can do was pure science fiction just 3 years ago?

What they can do was not science fiction, these things are all based on papers that were written decades ago, with the caveat that there's simply not enough compute power. Now there is. That's what changed. Everything on top of that is an incremental improvement.

It doesn't change the fact that LLMs are not, and never will be, AGI.

Re: Sam Altman Won in Court Against Elon Musk. But, We All Lost

#80
musk sued long after the statute of limitations because what openai did was only objectionable to musk once he decided to become their competitor.

and in this scenario, i’m supposed to root for musk who tried to use the court to harm a competitor who’s winning in the marketplace against xAI?

no thanks. if you can’t compete in the marketplace, the court isn’t your backup plan. there’s nothing. positive about the weaponization of the courts.

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