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Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

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Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#201

Post by SanjayMehta »

WillAdams wrote: post #78
SanjayMehta wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a Thinkpad style USB keyboard meant for server racks. Has a trackpad and that little joystick. It's only flaw is it that it's too old for that windows key.

There are newer versions which have that key: Lenovo Group Limited Lenovo ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard with TrackPoint (I bought half-a-dozen the last time they were made so that I would be sure of having one in the future).

Are they as well built as the IBM ones? I saw a Thinkpad 14 recently, quite light and it felt flimsy. Different type of plastic.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#202

Post by alsetmusic »

mathisfun123 wrote: post #153
alsetmusic wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a crappy thing to say to someone speaking honestly and passionately . I don’t worship the guy but I sure as hell consider myself lucky to have watched the iPhone announcement live on a webstream. It’s inarguably one of the most important products in human history. It changed all of our lives whether you own one or not. You can argue that someone else would have got there eventually, but Apple did it first and it…

> one of the most important products in human history the pill (birth control) and the washing machine were the two single most significant products of the 20th century due to their role in liberating women. i can think of others (the light bulb, the car, the television). do you really believe the iphone compares (in terms of historical significance) to these products? > And if it didn’t amaze you, I think you’re bit…

If we want to be pedantic, the transistor is perhaps the linchpin of the modern world. The combustable engine before that, of course. And if we really want to divorce the conversation from its origin, I believe that systems of writing are the most important invention in human history.

>> I was on the team that delivered the first iPad and you wouldn’t believe how excited we were for the announcement as other companies introduced tablets that weren’t anywhere near as good during the months leading up to it.

> being proud of your work is fine. assuming it is of historical importance is arrogant. sorry again.

I didn't say my work was historically important. I said I was on a team working on a similar project during that time period. The _iPhone is historically important_ and I specifically called it out as such by stating that the team that built it did the impossible.

Either you're putting words in my mouth or you genuinely don't understand the points I'm making. I was talking about the enthusiasm of _my team_, which was not the iPhone team, because I wanted to portray the enthusiasm of the employees building products under the CEO being discussed. The iPhone team genuinely changed the world.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#203

Post by coldtea »

pjmlp wrote: post #175
coldtea wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's not be overly dramatic about that period. Apple was not days away from going bust. They were months away from filing bankruptcy. They were still a multi-billion dollar company even then. So? No shortage of "multi-billion dollar companies" that became footnotes. Blackberry. Nokia. SGI. ... Let's be overly dramatic, cause it's more accurate to how bad they had it.

Nokia is hardly a footnote, they even own UNIX birthplace nowadays. People only know Nokia Mobiles, however Nokia Neteworks never went away and is more than healthy, owning plenty of key telecommunications infrastructure world wide.

>Nokia is hardly a footnote, they even own UNIX birthplace nowadays.

It's not exactly the pinnacle of corporate achievement owning a non-relevant for decades labs. Might as well own the birthplace of ENIAC too.

But also not very relevant to the discussion: Nokia had the infrastructure busines to rely on, while it's consumer side tanked. Apple only had the tanking consumer side. That side of Nokia is what we're comparing it with.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#204

Post by rbanffy »

WillAdams wrote: post #76
rbanffy wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wasn't PowerPoint also based on an application initially made for NeXT?

I don't think so --- it was originally a Mac application done by a company named Forethought, Inc. in 1987 (per Wikipedia), while the NeXT didn't come out until late in 1998

I must have confused them though. Funny to think such an important part of Office originated outside Microsoft.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#205

Post by mathisfun123 »

alsetmusic wrote: post #202
mathisfun123 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one of the most important products in human history the pill (birth control) and the washing machine were the two single most significant products of the 20th century due to their role in liberating women. i can think of others (the light bulb, the car, the television). do you really believe the iphone compares (in terms of historical significance) to these products? > And if it didn’t amaze you, I think you’re bit…

If we want to be pedantic, the transistor is perhaps the linchpin of the modern world. The combustable engine before that, of course. And if we really want to divorce the conversation from its origin, I believe that systems of writing are the most important invention in human history. >> I was on the team that delivered the first iPad and you wouldn’t believe how excited we were for the announcement as other companie…

> If we want to be pedantic, the transistor is perhaps the linchpin of the modern world

Great example. Shockly and Bardeen got a nobel for it. Did Steve Jobs get a nobel for the iPhone? Sorry I'm not aware.

> The iPhone team genuinely changed the world

I feel like not a single person on this site has ever taken a writing class.

My guy you've repeated this claim thrice now without a single instance/indication for how. Do you not understand that I don't agree with you and therefore your job (if you choose) is to convince me, not just reiterate the same shtick over and over hoping I just magically change my mind.

Edit: it's amazing to me how asinine this discussion is. Only on hn would I be debating whether removing a physical keyboard from a consumer electronics device is considered a historical event. If you think it was more than that, that the iPhone ushered in the era of mobile connectivity, you're delusional (but I guess the reality distortion field is still strong at AP).

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#206

Post by ghaff »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #201
WillAdams wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are newer versions which have that key: Lenovo Group Limited Lenovo ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard with TrackPoint (I bought half-a-dozen the last time they were made so that I would be sure of having one in the future).

Are they as well built as the IBM ones? I saw a Thinkpad 14 recently, quite light and it felt flimsy. Different type of plastic.

I think modern Thinkpads are still pretty solid laptops. I'm not going to make an argument that they're as solidly built as IBM Thinkpads of 20 years ago though they're probably more reliable overall.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#207

Post by andrekandre »

mentos wrote: post #198
andrekandre wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

more like social media (but isn't this a bit off topic?)

Smart phones are what made social media toxic. The last sacred mile of our social lives has been invaded and corrupted no? No one enjoys a concert or sunset without feeling the need to capture and share it. Who is to blame for that? Steve Jobs

  > Smart phones are what made social media toxic.
i dont know about that... usenet was a toxic mess alot of the time waaaay back, and facebook used on pc alot of the time is a total cesspool, same with 4chan etc etc... smartphones just made it more accessible, but it was always there...

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#208

Post by mrandish »

flomo wrote: post #171
mrandish wrote: post #130

I think a deeper dive into Job's evolution during the 12 years at Next is an excellent idea. However, I found statements like this concerning: "Apple version one was failure in many ways." In context, 'Apple version one' means Apple 1977 to 1985 (when Jobs left). But the Apple II product line was a huge success for more than a decade. That's a big thing to miss in an article claiming to correct historical mispercepti…

> "the Macintosh itself was not a commercial success" which is another strange claim Macintosh was in fact not successful for many years, and Apple survived by chanting "Apple II Forever!" at their legacy edu market. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcjlhFVTY50 Also the fail Apple III was Jobs' machine. Scully and Gasse made the Macintosh II line successful by marketing expensive workstations to creative professionals…

We probably don't disagree on much but nuanced details, which is why I said it was a "strange claim" instead of "incorrect".

Being a retro-head who lived through those days obsessively watching every twist and turn... with "strange claim" I was trying to convey it's a "commercial success" is a nuanced judgement on which reasonable people can disagree and any such absolute claims require clear definition of terms, scopes and time frames.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#209

Post by tracerbulletx »

pjmlp wrote: post #176
tracerbulletx wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's batshit that people still talk like apple is lost technically when apple silicon has absolutely crushed, airpods are the default headphone of the world, and macbooks are the best overall package available at all price points. And why? because they arent interested in VR and the glass aesthetic is kind of janky? Absolutely minor issues.

Apple fans live in a bubble, crushed what? Apple doesn't do servers, they decided to get out of that market. Apple decided it doesn't care about workstation market any longer. The desktop market worldwide is about 10%. The mobile devices market worldwide is about 30%. Sure it crushed, in the few countries where Apple rules like North America.

If you dont think apple silicon and rosetta rollout was a massively successful and high difficulty technical accomplishment I dont really know what to tell you. Just look at the windows ecosystems attempts to roll out arm devices. I can still use my 900 dollar m1 macbook air for almost anything and I have a desktop computer with 128gigs of memory and a 5090. And the battery lasts for days to the point I barely think of charging it. And my m5pro work laptop is just basically a perfect device. I think I use enough platforms to be a fair judge. I also detect the sloppiness in some of the software, im just saying in comparison its a pretty minor issue and theyre still executing way above the alternatives.

Re: Steve Jobs in Exile – New book on his years at NeXT Computer

#210

Post by [deleted] »

andrekandre wrote: post #207
mentos wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smart phones are what made social media toxic. The last sacred mile of our social lives has been invaded and corrupted no? No one enjoys a concert or sunset without feeling the need to capture and share it. Who is to blame for that? Steve Jobs

> Smart phones are what made social media toxic. i dont know about that... usenet was a toxic mess alot of the time waaaay back, and facebook used on pc alot of the time is a total cesspool, same with 4chan etc etc... smartphones just made it more accessible, but it was always there...

[deleted]
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