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The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

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Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#171

Post by LoganDark »

d-meth being the desirable one (leaving l-meth undesirable) matches up with my anecdotal experience with adderall, which is approximately equal parts d-amphetamine and l-amphetamine -- it's not quite methamphetamine, but it's closely related.

I was given some by prescription for ADHD, and when I first tried it, it completely destroyed me for some reason -- I could not seem to get myself out of bed to eat (or do much of anything), even when I was very hungry. I ended up having to sleep it off, because being awake for that was very distressing -- not only did it not help me, but it seemed it had caused me even greater executive dysfunction.

When I brought this up at my next appointment, I was prescribed pure d-amph to try next. This actually helped me a lot, and continues to help me to this day.

I can only guess that the l-amph was the problem with the adderall that day. While my body seems to also have issues with different brands of d-amph, they're more like heart issues rather than executive function issues.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#172

Post by LoganDark »

gaiagraphia wrote: post #169
keepamovin wrote: post #10

The ephedrine (or pseudoephedrine) synthesis is a one step using phosphorus/iodine reduction directly to methamphetamine. It’s simple and clean in that only an acid base extraction is required, and only one set of NP solvents. All these others syntheses with multiple steps up the chances of weird toxic solvents or contaminants creeping in. I think it’s a contaminant issue that’s exacerbated by the drug use. The gover…

I've bounced between viewpoints so many times in life regarding legalisation of drugs. It's a fascinating argument. Something which has always grounded my beliefs is the comparison to alcohol. Imagine we walked into bars and were presented with unmarked bottle of clear liquid, and had to order "1 alcohol, please!", where the alcohol % and quality of the drink was totally random. It'd be fucking chaos. I think I've se…

I believe harm reduction is the answer. There are people who will be curious to try substances no matter what you do -- and no matter for what reason.

Here is some of what the US has been doing ever since the "war on drugs" started:

- Ban the sale of such substances, forcing users to resort to the black market.

- Lock up anyone who uses or possesses such substances, training users that there is no help for them.

- Lock up anyone who helps or intends to help anyone else use or possess such substances, training users that there is no helping others.

- Censor information on how to reduce the risks of substance use, forcing users to put themselves in more danger. (Contrary to apparent popular belief, this does not dissuade users, only harm them.)

- Censor information on how to produce or obtain such substances, preventing the discovery of reliable sources.

- Engage in relentless fearmongering about how terrible and bad such substances are, encouraging users to entirely disregard all warnings about substance use.

In my opinion, here is what one should actually do:

- Regulate the production and sale of such substances. Don't force users to resort to the black market.

- Encourage harm reduction and responsibility towards substance use. Don't train users that there is no help for them.

- Warn only of the real risks and concerns about substance use. Don't train users to disregard very real dangers by flooding them with fake ones.

- Offer reliable sources for such substances. Don't force users to resort to dubious leads.

Recent research into psilocybin therapy, for instance, is very exciting. I've been using psychedelics at home for years, and I dream of a world where known quantities and potencies of such things can be reliably sourced over-the-counter for such use. I don't know if I'll live to see the day.

Also note that none of this prevents helping users who genuinely need it -- users with less self-control, for instance, or harmful dependency. But forcing them all into terrible shame, withdrawal and eventually an utterly preventable death, is the same kind of bullshit that looked at building more homes and then invented anti-homeless architecture instead.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#173

Post by [deleted] »

lukan wrote: post #98
hash872 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The government should just regulate it, control purity and production and let people access small amounts for recreation/performance Famously, the US spent about 15-20 years attempting this with opioids. They were widely available to people via a pseudo-medical process, or via secondhand dealing. Opioids were/are manufactured by regulated, publicly traded companies with inspectors who controlled purity and productio…

"the Wiki page for the opioid crisis is quite clear that at least 50% of all deaths were due to perfectly legal, regulated opioids" Are you talking about this page? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_epidemic Could you then be more clear where exactly your claim came from? I did not find it, but rather this: "According to medical professionals, supervised injection sites are effective in reducing overdose deaths an…

[deleted]

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#174

Post by sidewndr46 »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #164
ptrl600 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Losing 5 pounds a month, 20 down and 10 to go.

Do I understand correctly that you're using it as an appetite suppressant? How effective has it been for you? Particularly considering that you're already drinking coffee and I would have expected caffeine to have the stronger effect there. Also out of curiosity why not go with one of the new peptides?

It varies quite wildly according to individual it would seem. Some people take it no issue. I generally avoid pseudoephedrine because it is a noticeable stimulant for me.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#175

Post by sidewndr46 »

trhway wrote: post #24
milesvp wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking the same thing, though I couldn't remember the timeline. Makes me wonder if there was something already in the zeitgeist, or if it was fueled by the obsession with purity in the series. I could totally see Breaking Bad causing chemists to want to up their game, or causing chemists to get clowned for having low purity.

yes, while the show probably popularized the idea of purity for meth, in general strict prohibition leads to increase in purity and potency. We've recently seen that with heroin/fentanyl. There is probably still no "fentanyl of meth", and thus so far only purity increase. Once a more potent, fentanyl-like, meth appears, it will probably similarly get into and displace a lot of classic meth trade.

Aren't cathinones the equivalent for meth?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substituted_cathinone

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#176

Post by kilroy123 »

keepamovin wrote: post #10

The ephedrine (or pseudoephedrine) synthesis is a one step using phosphorus/iodine reduction directly to methamphetamine. It’s simple and clean in that only an acid base extraction is required, and only one set of NP solvents. All these others syntheses with multiple steps up the chances of weird toxic solvents or contaminants creeping in. I think it’s a contaminant issue that’s exacerbated by the drug use. The gover…

I have a wild idea. Why not spend that money on providing good mental health and rehabilitation services instead?

I have multiple close family members who have struggled badly with drug and alcohol abuse. Good treatment is the way, not the government handing out drugs.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#177

Post by sidewndr46 »

trhway wrote: post #6

>He points out that “old” meth was made from ephedrine and that “new” meth is made from a chemical called Phenylacetone or P2P the new is just the old that came back. The old meth, "biker meth", was P2P. Then was ephedrine, and with a crackdown on ephedrine - back to P2P. Another noticeable thing - the recent shortage of ADHD medication while supposedly illegal meth production has been growing. Demand is present in b…

Is there really a shortage of ADHD medications? As in we cannot synthesize and distribute them?

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#178

Post by wallst07 »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #113
cyberax wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, now the war on drug is over and we see that the harms from _not_ doing it are worse. In 2023, overdoses overtook gun and traffic deaths _combined_. Surrendering to the drugs was a mistake. Yeah, we should have changed tactics. Zero-tolerance policies were terrible nonsense, long prison terms were not helpful, and we should have clamped on prescription pills way sooner. > but ineffective or counterproductive at…

It seems like you've already made up your mind what to believe. In particular you've failed to critically analyze the broader context in which overdose deaths went up and I also have to question your suggestion that the war on drugs in the US ever ended. Sure, marijuana is largely accepted at this point. Most other things you still buy from gangsters on a street corner or via the darknet and will still be arrested fo…

We may be able the war on drugs has ended or not on how you define it.

The nancy ragean area levels , i would say yes. Rates are down. https://drugabusestatistics.org/drug-related-crime-statistic...

However, it certainly hasn't gone to 0 and is still quite high.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#179

Post by keepamovin »

kilroy123 wrote: post #176
keepamovin wrote: post #10

The ephedrine (or pseudoephedrine) synthesis is a one step using phosphorus/iodine reduction directly to methamphetamine. It’s simple and clean in that only an acid base extraction is required, and only one set of NP solvents. All these others syntheses with multiple steps up the chances of weird toxic solvents or contaminants creeping in. I think it’s a contaminant issue that’s exacerbated by the drug use. The gover…

I have a wild idea. Why not spend that money on providing good mental health and rehabilitation services instead? I have multiple close family members who have struggled badly with drug and alcohol abuse. Good treatment is the way, not the government handing out drugs.

Except when psychedelics are a part of the good treatment.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#180

Post by scragz »

vintermann wrote: post #92
KarlKode wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a astronomically better example would be programs in the Netherlands, Denmark or Switzerland, where people heavily addicted to heroine can get into programs that will provide them with pharmaceutical heroine. Still prescribed by doctors (although specialized ones), but not just for pulling a wisdom tooth with huge margins for the Sacklers...

A problem LAR programs have had since the start is that although methadone is less attractive as a drug than heroin, it's still attractive, and basically the only way to figure out how much a heroin addict needs is to ask them. Leading to users asking for extra, selling the excess (to users who were not in the LAR program) and buying other drugs with the profits. For some years, more people died from methadone overdo…

methadone is not a less harmful substitute, it's just the one that makes official people money. the withdrawals are worse.
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