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Ghostty is leaving GitHub
911–920 of 1001 posts
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#912Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hi there! Longtime fan and hubber here. It's okay to have emotions. I have similar emotions. I'm GitHub User 22723 which is effectively the same as you (considering there's ~180m GH accounts nowadays) My version of your post reads differently: "GitHub only gets better if people who give a shit stick around to make it better" Walking away would be easy. I felt that way when I left Heroku ~six years ago. I left that jo…
I used to work at GitHub. I think you should find a new job. Before Microsoft came along, the entire company was aligned from the bottom to the top around the goal of delivering a single great product. As soon as they bought us, that changed; there were now lots of ways for an individual to succeed at GitHub-the-division-of-Microsoft that had nothing to do with GitHub-the-product. Now GitHub doesn't even have its own…
I would argue it goes even a step further: any org the size of Microsoft struggles to maintain the quality of... well, anything. And, added to that, Microsoft seems exceptionally bad at doing fucking anything now. Azure is a complete mess, Windows is an utter dumpster fire, the office suite feels like it gets just slightly worse with every update, Copilot is a fucking joke compared to every other AI on offer (and hilariously, will agree with everything I've said here!), they won't even use their own frameworks to develop software anymore!
Microsoft is literally too big to fail and it's their sole asset at this point. When companies like Github get bought by Microsoft, I just put a clock on the wall in my mind. Just a matter of time before the shit seeps in.
They can't help it. They are organizationally unable to function. It's so much worse than misaligned incentives and redundant management (though those are factors): they seem culturally, institutionally, unable to just... DO ANYTHING. Everything they do is 1 step forward and 4-20 steps back. They are too big and they should be broken up for their own good as well as the good of every user of their software.
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#913Earlier quoted context omitted.
For me the main issue with git-bug is that they are not dogfooding it. However , it's also one of the few projects that is actually trying to solve the core problem, rather than skirting around it. (well I now learned of radicle in this thread and they seem to store issues in git and even have PR support I think)
> For me the main issue with git-bug is that they are not dogfooding it. This is incorrect. $ git remote get-url origin ssh://git@github.com/git-bug/git-bug.git $ for n in bugs identities; do echo "${n} on the remote: " $(git ls-remote origin "refs/${n}/\*" | wc -l); done bugs on the remote: 453 identities on the remote: 311 See the related issue for more info: https://github.com/git-bug/git-bug/issues/1221#issuecomm…
Glad to hear about the web UI changes, git-bug has been really great for my projects that exist across forges so I look forward to testing it out :)
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#914Earlier quoted context omitted.
If anyone reading this is curious of their own, you can go to https://api.github.com/users/YOUR_USERNAME_HERE and fetch it. My ID is just over 10,000. Crazy to think of the journey that I've had in computing since I signed up for GitHub.
Thanks for the link. ID: 67,498 Created: 2009-03-26 17 years, a month and two days ago.
I was a day after you, march 27th. #67730
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#915I can appreciate Hashimoto's genuine feelings about Github, and the world of open-source software development that it opened for him and that he spent a significant chunk of his life participating in. On the other hand, I can't help but think that some of this heartbreak would have been avoidable, if only he possessed more of the Richard-Stallman-esque attitude that non-free software is inherently suspect and unethic…
> I can't help but think that some of this heartbreak would have been avoidable, if only he possessed more of the Richard-Stallman-esque attitude that non-free software is inherently suspect and unethical. I think that model works well when it comes to code , but I don't think the non-free software movement ever really figured out how to deal with services and data . Even if GitHub was completely 100% GPL Free Softwa…
You're completely right. I care about the free software movement from an ethical/freedom-preserving perspective, and I do think that many facets of the movement are too grounded in the details of how personal computer software in the 80s and 90s worked, rather than in the question of how to import the user-freedom-perserving ethos to services and data.
The question of how to create free-software-mediated online communities that don't involve storing user identity and data in a company's private database is critical. The user database, and what can be built upon it, is the single biggest reason people do use Github despite its flaws.
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#916The thing you love has been bought by Microsoft. When things belong to a large corporation, they can (and probably will) drift off in some absurd direction, because in a way, the relationship is reversed. The thing no longer serves you; instead, the brand, the user base, the reputation, and the key role and function of the thing are put at the service of investors. In this process, you are demoted from subject to obj…
Are you… explaining the effects of being acquired to Hashimoto?
But keep in mind the demographics of chat. 80% of the commenters are much smarter and more knowledgeable than the other 80%.
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#917Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#918During one of the x threads where Mitchell was (legitimately) complaining about Github, there were a couple replies suggesting that GitHub should hire him to be their CEO. And I remember seeing that and thinking "huh... not at all a bad idea." There is a specific kind of leader that can turn such ships around, and they are strong in their convictions, and aren't just "managers", but visionaries coupled with strong ex…
The problem is that Github does a lot . However, I consider that there is still not a great UI for the core service, in special for a complex project. In the other hand, I bet jujutsu has the best basic take, and is still missing a good forge.
It does a lot but at the end of the day, if the core functionality is just not good anymore, maybe put all the side projects on the actual side and focus on how to make sure core functionality suck less.
For example - We adopted GitHub Actions, then we swapped it out this year. Our own primary use case is code hosting + PRs. We want it to talk to the other (better) tools that intended for their use case. We want it in a secure yet fast and available manner. Nothing else. I don't care about projects, issues, or whatever super app they're trying to become.
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#919Earlier quoted context omitted.
I used to think people who said Github had become very unreliable were exagerating, but I can't miss it now. If you want to keep people, you have to actually go down less. It's interesting that internally you had a very different experience with Salesforce buying Heroku and Microsoft buying Github. From the outside it appears to be analagous (except github is degrading quicker than Heroku did?)
> It's interesting that internally you had a very different experience with Salesforce buying Heroku and Microsoft buying Github. From the outside it appears to be analagous (except github is degrading quicker than Heroku did?) This pops up on here frequently. People misremember the Heroku timeline with Salesforce. Most of Heroku's growth and glory days happened after the acquisition. Salesforce actively invested in…
I am aware, and I am often the one making that point -- but here we have someone who worked at heroku saying he experienced the SalesForce acquisition as immediately negative and with signals that it was not going to get better and this caused him to leave, so I was discussing within that narrative. I was more intersted in learning about his take from his experience than in trying to tell him he was wrong and salesforce was great for heroku despite his experience working there?
But yes, heroku from the outside kept doing quite well for the first years of Salesforce ownership, whether becuase they let them alone and kept their budget going, or whatever. That's why I suggested that from the outside github's slide was much faster.
idan (who again, tells us they worked at heroku) replied to me in this thread:
> Salesforce never understood Heroku. Salesforce's understanding of Heroku, if such an understanding ever existed, was wildly different than what Heroku understood it wanted to be. Benioff's penchant for buying himself a company every year did not help — "no headcount this year, we're buying Mulesoft/Quip/Tableau/Slack/$WHATEVER. And oops we spent too much money on dreamforce. Sucks that your pager rotations are burning people out!" It was very clear they did not give a shit about us, as evidenced by resources.
> It's safe to say that I'm hypersensitive to these antipatterns and have been looking out for them at GitHub, and I don't see them.
At the point we're quoting other people's replies in other parts of the thread becuase we're not all even having the same conversation anymore, we're probably done!
Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub
#920Earlier quoted context omitted.
What should we do? The only thing I can think of is to stay vocal about it. Never accept enshittification. Always point things out when they suck.
Not selling out, basically. Easier said than done.
If you have the choice to sell out or not sell out, the only logical decision is to sell out, because then you'll have lots of money and one presumes the product wasn't emotionally important to you. You can then move on to making your next product.