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Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

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Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#421

Opinions are my own. I think the biggest winner of this might be Google. Virtually all the frontier AI labs use TPU. The only one that doesn't use TPU is OpenAI due to the exclusive deal with Microsoft. Given the newly launched Gen 8 TPU this month, it's likely OpenAI will contemplate using TPU too.

You think the company that just gave 40B to Anthropic is the winner? Interesting.

That deal is a win-win for Google. If they develop a better coding model than Anthropic and beat them at coding, then they win. If they don’t, they still win by making a ton of money from Anthropic long term.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#422
post #413

A wise man from Google said in an internal memo to the tune of: "We do not have any moat neither does anyone else." Deepseek v4 is good enough, really really good given the price it is offered at. PS: Just to be clear - even the most expensive AI models are unreliable, would make stupid mistakes and their code output MUST be reviewed carefully so Deepseek v4 is not any different either, it too is just a random token…

I agree. Data and userbase are still the moats.

Once a new model or a technique is invented, it’s just a matter of time until it becomes a free importable library.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#423
post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's hilarious though it's like people are LARPing a Fortune company CEO when they're giving their hot takes on social media reminds me of Trump ending his wild takes on social media with "thank you for your attention to this matter" - so out of place, it makes it really funny *typo

> it's like people are LARPing a Fortune company CEO when they're giving their hot takes on social media At least in large tech companies, they have mandatory social media training where they explicitly tell employees to use phrases like "my views are my own" to keep it clear whether they're speaking on behalf of their employer or not.

i've worked in two different large tech companies

when i give my hot takes pseudonymously on social media these phrases would be nothing but a LARP

i don't put my real name here nor do i put my professional commitments in my profile, and neither does this guy

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#424
post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's hilarious though it's like people are LARPing a Fortune company CEO when they're giving their hot takes on social media reminds me of Trump ending his wild takes on social media with "thank you for your attention to this matter" - so out of place, it makes it really funny *typo

> it's like people are LARPing a Fortune company CEO when they're giving their hot takes on social media At least in large tech companies, they have mandatory social media training where they explicitly tell employees to use phrases like "my views are my own" to keep it clear whether they're speaking on behalf of their employer or not.

Why would they be speaking on behalf of their employer? That is what would need a disclaimer not the common case. Besides, he can put it one time in his profile, not over and over again in every comment like he does. There is no expectation that some random employee is a spokesperson for Google on tech message board comment threads. It's just a way to brag.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#425
post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's like people are LARPing a Fortune company CEO when they're giving their hot takes on social media At least in large tech companies, they have mandatory social media training where they explicitly tell employees to use phrases like "my views are my own" to keep it clear whether they're speaking on behalf of their employer or not.

i've worked in two different large tech companies when i give my hot takes pseudonymously on social media these phrases would be nothing but a LARP i don't put my real name here nor do i put my professional commitments in my profile, and neither does this guy

Exactly. There is no scenario where we should expect some random anon to be speaking for Google. When that is the case a disclaimer is warranted, not the common case of speaking for oneself. He can write it once in his profile if he's so worried about it, not every other comment like he does. It's just inflated self importance

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#426
post #413

A wise man from Google said in an internal memo to the tune of: "We do not have any moat neither does anyone else." Deepseek v4 is good enough, really really good given the price it is offered at. PS: Just to be clear - even the most expensive AI models are unreliable, would make stupid mistakes and their code output MUST be reviewed carefully so Deepseek v4 is not any different either, it too is just a random token…

Can Deepseek answer probing questions about Winnie the Pooh?

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? FaceBook largely requires an Apple iPhone, Apple computer, "Microsoft" computer, "Google" phone, or a "Google" computer to use it. At any point one of those companies could cut FaceBook off (ex. [1]). The Metaverse was a long term goal to get people onto a device (Occulus) that Meta controlled. While I think an AR device is much more useful than VR; I'm not convinced that it's a mistake for Meta to peruse not be…

I think this is sane washing their idea in the modern context of it having failed. I think at the time, they thought VR would be the next big thing and wanted to become the dominant player via first mover advantage. The headsets don’t really make sense to me in the way you’re describing. Phones are omnipresent because it’s a thing you always just have on you. Headsets are large enough that it’s a conscious choice to…

I think headsets might work, but I think Meta trying to use their first mover advantage so hard so early backfired. Oculus, as a device, became less desirable after it required Facebook integration.

It's kind of like Microsoft with copilot - the idea about having an AI assistant that can help you use the computer is great. But it can't be from Microsoft because people don't trust them with that.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#428
post #397
post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am never producing a probability distribution of words (at least not in a way that my conscious self can determine) Inability to introspect your own word selections does not mean it’s meaningfully different from what an LLM does. There is plenty of evidence that humans do a lot of things that are not driven by conscious choice and we rationalize it after the fact. > I consider an entire idea and then decide what…

> Inability to introspect your own word selections does not mean it’s meaningfully different from what an LLM does. There is plenty of evidence that humans do a lot of things that are not driven by conscious choice and we rationalize it after the fact. This is correct and also completely irrelevant. I am describing what I experience, and describing how my experience seems very different to next token prediction. I th…

I'm telling you how these technologies work. When a language model isn't performing inference, it is not doing anything. A language model is a function which takes a token stream as input and produces a token probability distribution as output. By definition, there is no thinking outside of producing words. The function isn't running.

If what you are saying is true, then LLMs wouldn't be able to handle out-of-distribution math problems without resorting to tool use. Yet they can. When you ask a current-generation model to multiply some 8-digit numbers, and forbid it from using tools or writing a script, it will almost certainly give you the right answer. That includes local models that can't possibly cheat. LLMs are stochastic, but they are not parrots.

At the risk of sounding like an LLM myself, whatever process makes this possible is not simply next-token prediction in the pejorative sense you're applying to it. It can't be. The tokens in a transformer network are evidently not just words in a Markov chain but a substrate for reasoning. The model is generalizing processes it learned, somehow, in the course of merely being trained to predict the next token.

Mechanically, yes, next-token prediction is what it's doing, but that turns out to be a much more powerful mechanism than it appeared at first. My position is that our brains likely employ similar mechanism(s), albeit through very different means.

It is scarcely believable that this abstraction process is limited to keeping track of intermediate results in math problems. The implications should give the stochastic-parrot crowd some serious cognitive dissonance, but...

(Edit: it occurs to me that you are really arguing that the continuous versus discrete nature of human thinking is what's important here. If so, that sounds like a motte-and-bailey thing that doesn't move the needle on the argument that originally kicked off the subthread.)

(Edit 2, again due to rate-limiting: it does sound like you've fallen back to a continuous-versus-discrete argument, and that's not something I've personally thought much about or read much about. I stand by my point that the ability to do arithmetic without external tools is sufficient to dispense with the stochastic-parrot school of thought, and that's all I set out to argue here.)

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#429
post #20

Pursue "new opportunities"? Microslop is dumping OpenAI and wishes it well in its new endeavors.

I read this as the other way. OpenAI was desperate to dump Microsoft.

I linked this in another comment but Azure has problems and OpenAI is tired of waiting.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47616242

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#430
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything is personal preference, and perhaps I am more fiscally conservative because I grew up in poverty. But if I own 49% of a company and that company has more hype than product, hasn't found its market yet but is valued at trillions? I'm going to sell percentages of that to build my war chest for things that actually hit my bottom line. The "moonshot" has for all intents and purposes been achieved based on the…

They haven’t sold anything they’ve been diluted.

A company can dilute just like that?
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