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DeepSeek v4

api-docs.deepseek.com

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Re: DeepSeek v4

#391

Post by amunozo »

sigmoid10 wrote: post #332
chvid wrote: post #322

The incredible arrogance and hybris of the American initiated tech war - it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. The US-China contest aside - it is in the application layer llms will show their value. There the field, with llm commoditization and no clear monopolies, is wide open. There was a point in time where it looked like llms would the domain of a single well guarded monopoly - that would have…

Still not sure how I feel about China of all places to control the only alternative AI stack, but I guess it's better than leaving everything to the US alone. If China ever feels emboldened enough to go for Taiwan and the US descends into complete chaos, the rest of the world running on AI will be at the mercy of authoritarian regimes. At the very least you can be sure noone is in this for the good of the people anym…

Competition with the Soviet Union gave all the workers in the world better conditions, also advances in science and technology... (And risk of mutual destruction ;)), even if the USSR wasn't good.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#392

Post by alpineman »

sixhobbits wrote: post #284

I know people don't like Twitter links here but the main link just goes to their main docs site generic 'getting started' page. The website now has a link to the announcement on Twitter here https://x.com/deepseek_ai/status/2047516922263285776 Copying text of that below DeepSeek-V4 Preview is officially live & open-sourced! Welcome to the era of cost-effective 1M context length. DeepSeek-V4-Pro: 1.6T total / 49B acti…

Just use xcancel by adding 'cancel' to the link

https://xcancel.com/deepseek_ai/status/2047516922263285776

Re: DeepSeek v4

#393

Post by rhubarbtree »

sudo_cowsay wrote: post #292
jari_mustonen wrote: post #239

Open Source as it gets in this space, top notch developer documentation, and prices insanely low, while delivering frontier model capabilities. So basically, this is from hackers to hackers. Loving it! Also, note that there's zero CUDA dependency. It runs entirely on Huawei chips. In other words, Chinese ecosystem has delivered a complete AI stack. Like it or not, that's a big news. But what's there not to like when…

I sometimes wonder if there are any security risks with using Chinese LLMs. Is there?

Backdooring software at scale.

Spearphishing.

Building reliance and exploiting it, through state subsidies, dumping, and market manipulation.

Handicapping provision to the west for competitive advantage.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#394

Post by FuckButtons »

randomNumber7 wrote: post #289
elefanten wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not remotely hypothetical you’d have to be living under a rock to believe that. And the fusion with a one-party state government that doesn’t tolerate huge swathes of thoughtspace being freely discussed is completely streamlined, not mediated by any guardrails or accountability. This “no harm to me” meme about a foreign totalitarian government (with plenty of incentive to run influence ops on foreigners) hooveri…

The USA has one of the highest percentages of their population in prison. Even for minor stuff like beeing addicted to drugs. Looks pretty totalitarian to me.

I’ll be sure to pick up my copy of the peoples daily to read about those statistics in the morning.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#395

Post by alecco »

kortilla wrote: post #298
alecco wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't slander the most open AI company in the world. Even more open than some non-profit labs from universities. DeepSeek is famous for publishing everything . They might take a bit to publish source code but it's almost always there. And their papers are extremely pro-social to help the broader open AI community. This is why they struggle getting funded because investors hate openness. And in China they strug…

It’s not slander to say something true. These are open weights, not open source. They don’t provide the training data or the methodology requires to reproduce these weights. So you can’t see what facts are pruned out, what biases were applied, etc. Even more importantly, you can’t make a slightly improved version. This model is as open source as a windows XP installation ISO.

> These are open weights, not open source.

Did you even read my comment?

Re: DeepSeek v4

#397

Post by mettamage »

koe123 wrote: post #355
jurgenburgen wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know if we’re ahead of the curve but that tired feeling has started turning into hate here in the EU. I guess being threatened with invasion does that to you. The next decade is going to look very different with America Alone.

I grew up in the states when I was younger, always feeling some closeness to Americans even after I moved back to Europe. With all that goes on it has changed. Recently I sat on a plane near some Americans discussing their holidays here, and I noticed I felt contempt. Sitting their with insane privilege as their government torches the world. Individuals remain individuals, and one really ought not to be prejudice. Ho…

From my small bubble it's not that. I'm Dutch, married to an American who now knows enough Dutch such that we can treat it as a secret language when we're in the US.

My family in law seems to swing slightly republican. As a Dutchie, I could get some answers because I'm too naive not to talk about politics. So I got to probe a bit. What I simply found was that they'd say "I can't trust the news, none of it. Not CNN, not Fox News, nothing". Then I'd say "well in the Netherlands, I'd argue that while news outlets have their bias, you can trust them on basic factual reporting". She looked at me with a stare that I could only describe as "oh but honey, you're too young and naive to understand". To which I thought "you don't know the Netherlands. We're not perfect but we're nowhere near as deranged as what I'm seeing here".

I think that explains a lot of it for some people. The trust in the media, all media, is completely broken. Trump has how many fellonies now? Can't trust it. Kamala is doing what now? All talk. DOGE is fixing the government? I fucking hope so! But can't trust the damn news. Whether they do or don't, they are always burning money, god damn bureaucrats.

I feel that's the mindset that my family in law has.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#398

Post by michaelt »

elefanten wrote: post #208
b65e8bee43c2ed0 wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American companies want a scan of your asshole for the privilege of paying to access their models, and unapologetically admit to storing, analyzing, training on, and freely giving your data to any authorities if requested. Chinese ulteriority is hypothetical, American is blatant.

It’s not remotely hypothetical you’d have to be living under a rock to believe that. And the fusion with a one-party state government that doesn’t tolerate huge swathes of thoughtspace being freely discussed is completely streamlined, not mediated by any guardrails or accountability. This “no harm to me” meme about a foreign totalitarian government (with plenty of incentive to run influence ops on foreigners) hooveri…

The oppression of people in China like Uyghurs and Hong Kong, the complete lack of free speech, the saber-rattling at neighbours, and the lack of respect for intellectual property are indeed all well documented.

But for folks on the opposite side of the world, the threats are more like "they're selling us electric cars and solar panels too cheaply" and the hypothetical "these super cheap CCTV cameras could be used for remote spying"

Re: DeepSeek v4

#399

Post by eucyclos »

sudo_cowsay wrote: post #292
jari_mustonen wrote: post #239

Open Source as it gets in this space, top notch developer documentation, and prices insanely low, while delivering frontier model capabilities. So basically, this is from hackers to hackers. Loving it! Also, note that there's zero CUDA dependency. It runs entirely on Huawei chips. In other words, Chinese ecosystem has delivered a complete AI stack. Like it or not, that's a big news. But what's there not to like when…

I sometimes wonder if there are any security risks with using Chinese LLMs. Is there?

From my experience, kinda the opposite? It's like Chinese software is... Harder to weaponize or hurt yourself on. Deepseek is definitely censored, but I've never caught it being dishonest in a sneaky way.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#400

Post by HatchedLake721 »

barrenko wrote: post #369
ifwinterco wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Brit I'm here for it to be honest, I'm tired of America with everything that's going on. China is not perfect but a bit of competition is healthy and needed

[flagged]

UK has the people but not the electric grid/infrastructure to compete.

EU/France has Mistral.

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