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Framework Laptop 13 Pro

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Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#151

Post by iknowstuff »

zekica wrote: post #140
jasonjmcghee wrote: post #42

Out of sheer curiosity, why do apple devices have astronomically longer battery life when sleeping? (How is the sleep so efficient?) I was busy with work and didn't touch my personal laptop for a few weeks and it still had well over half the battery.

Mainly because Microsoft wants to have "connected standby": the CPU is running in a low power mode (not powered off like "old" S3 sleep), can be turned on periodically and can turn on other devices even when the computer is "sleeping". My Zen2 based Lenovo laptop has 6-7 hours of battery when doing basic tasks in both Windows and Linux, but sleep on Linux lasts a week while on Windows it's empty in 24 hours.

Macs have that too, just implemented well. In addition, CPUs with connected standby don’t have the normal sleep so even on linux they run in connected standby. Maybe its less buggy in your case? Consider yourself lucky, lots of people encounter problems with sleep on linux

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#152

Post by ColonelPhantom »

nfriedly wrote: post #82
dehugger wrote: post #39

A laptop without a unified memory model is categorically incapable of being the "ultimate developer laptop". Framework already have Strix Halo machines, I don't know why they felt the need to hamstring this thing with Intel.

FWIW, the ordering page lets you also choose AMD Ryzen 350 / HX 370. It's not the Strix Halo chips you're hoping for, but it is something.

Hilariously, those AMD chips are way behind the Intels in terms of memory.

First off, I believe that Intel has its memory far more "unified". AMD typically has a stricter VRAM/RAM 'tradeoff' setting that does not exist on Intel in the same way to my knowledge. (See how on Strix Halo systems, there is a thing about "allocating" 96 GB to the GPU, which seems to be needed sometimes but prevents the CPU from accessing that memory.)

Secondly, the Panther Lake board has LPDDR5X LPCAMM2 memory at 7467 MT/s, while the AMD boards are stuck with DDR5 SODIMMs at a meagre 5600 MT/s. In other words, the Intel board gets a third more memory bandwidth!

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#153

Post by michaelt »

pojntfx wrote: post #17
jampekka wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Having mainline Linux on a system with 24h+ battery life in a 13" case is pretty damn impressive. Does it have such battery life on Linux? The benchmarks, apart from suspend battery life, are for Windows.

Don't see why it wouldn't - as long as pstate etc. works it should be the same. I'd argue it's probably better given that modern desktops use far less resources in the background compared to Windows I bet they don't publish Linux numbers because it depends on which desktop you use etc.

A lot of office workers these days spend a lot of time in video calls.

So to get the best battery life you need, for example, your browser to use GPU-accelerated video encoding and decoding.

Linux is something of a second-class citizen for both GPU vendors and browser vendors. So for example if you're using Firefox and an nvidia GPU on Linux? No video encode/decode acceleration for you. The browser will silently switch to CPU decoding.

This translates into worse battery life.

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#155

Post by uxcolumbo »

nrp wrote: post #91

I’m happy to answer questions folks have around the product (later today).

Any plans to have a keyboard with a trackpoint and thumb buttons? I Don't need a trackpad.

If you add this then you'll have a new customer for life.

The trackpoint is the only thing that keeps me chained to Thinkpads.

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#156

Post by jjice »

nrp wrote: post #91

I’m happy to answer questions folks have around the product (later today).

First off, Framework is maybe the most exciting company I've seen over the last 5 years. My Framework 13 AMD is a wonderful machine. Thank you to your and your team for the incredible work and commitment!

Two questions:

1. Will there will be a concrete guide to upgrading a standard Framework 13 to the Pro. I watched the video and read the page a few times, and I'm a bit confused what the whole process is and if all the required upgrades need to happen together, or if they can go piece meal.

2. With all the different components and increasing SKUs, I'd be a little worried that if I didn't upgrade to a Pro in the near future, that the old hardware would no longer be supported and it'd be a headache to upgrade at some point. Can Framework guarantee that there will always be an upgrade path within a size and line?

Again, big thank you to Framework and I look forward to using my Framework 13 for a long, long time :)

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#157

Post by rafram »

Lammy wrote: post #54
kingsleyopara wrote: post #14

I really want to love this thing but at least in the UK, matching specs it comes out as more expensive than the MBP - even worse when you factor in potential discounts/sales which framework doesn't offer. Framework 13 Pro: £2064 (Ultra X7 358H, 16GB, 1TB, default ports, no adapter) Framework 13 Pro: £2264 (Ultra X7 358H, 32GB, 1TB, default ports, no adapter) MacBook Pro 14: £1699 (M5, 16GB, 1TB, no adapter) MacBook P…

Dumb comparison, because buying a Framework is a single transaction where I exchange money for a computer, and buying a Mac is an entrypoint to “The Ecosystem” where Apple wants to squeeze me for $ /month forever. Peep the margins on “Products” versus “Services” and you will understand what Apple's incentives are and why just selling me hardware isn't it: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/fy2026-q1/FY26_Q1_Consol..…

It's really not, though. You don't even need an Apple account to set up a Mac.

I pay $3/month to Apple in exchange for full-quality backups of decades of photos, but I could easily stop doing that, or switch to another provider, if I wanted to. (I don't, because $3/month is extremely fair for what I get.) I've never paid for any other Apple service and likely never will. The OS never, ever nags me about services - compare that to Windows!

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#159

Post by ColonelPhantom »

dehugger wrote: post #99
luyu_wu wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The iGP can access shared memory the same as with any modern system. I'm confused where you got this idea from.

There is a huge difference between on-die and off-die memory. Where that shared memory is located matters immensely.

You mentioned Strix Halo, which also has off-die memory. Strix Halo does have a real advantage from its wider memory bus (four channels for 256 bit instead of 128 bit), but Strix Point is equivalent-ish to Intel's platforms like Panther Lake or Arrow Lake in terms of memory setup.

In fact, Intel also had Lunar Lake, which had on-package memory. However, it was still limited to 128-bit dual-channel, so there weren't really many performance benefits; it did however help with power efficiency.

Re: Framework Laptop 13 Pro

#160

Post by wmf »

ndom91 wrote: post #130

Anyone know much about the new top of the line Intel vs AMD CPU options? Which is more power efficient? Powerful?

Intel Core Ultra 3xx is mostly better than AMD Ryzen 3xx/4xx. This year you're better off with Intel.
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