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All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

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Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#831

Post by deaux »

chromacity wrote: post #796
rythie wrote: post #584

It’s been long enough that people of forgotten what’s it’s like. Cameras still have replaceable batteries, there are several benefits: I can have two (or more) batteries, if it runs out I just change it. I don’t need walk around with a USB battery pack and cable hanging off the device preventing me from using it properly. I can put the battery on charge somewhere and leave it, even if not completely secure, because j…

Phones don't have removable batteries mostly because of the desire to make the device as thin as possible. The battery is just a delicate, flexible pouch that can easily be damaged and catch fire if removed from the phone and carried around. To make it safe, you'd need to add a hard shell, which would probably make the device 2 mm thicker or so. As to why we want to make phones as thin as possible... I don't know, bu…

> Phones don't have removable batteries mostly because of the desire to make the device as thin as possible. The battery is just a delicate, flexible pouch that can easily be damaged and catch fire if removed from the phone and carried around. To make it safe, you'd need to add a hard shell, which would probably make the device 2 mm thicker or so.

Fairphone 6, recent with replaceable battery: 9.6 mm

Galaxy S5, has a replaceable battery, released _12 years ago_ - battery tech has improved a lot since then: 8.1 mm

iPhone 17 Pro Max: 8.8 mm

iPhone 12 Pro Max: 7.4 mm

We want to make phones as thin as possible so the latest flagship iPhone is 1.4 mm thicker than the one from 5 years ago? A whole 0.8 mm thinner than a recent one with a replaceable battery with maybe 0.1% of the iPhone's R&D budget, and 0.8 mm thicker than one with a replaceable battery made 12 years ago?

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#832

Post by deaux »

nick486 wrote: post #801
bigfishrunning wrote: post #718

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because people will buy that phone and keep it much longer. When phones had replaceable batteries, they needed replaced after a couple of years because they were terrible. I'm now on a several year old pixel phone that I'm happy with, but eventually the battery will wear out and I'll have to replace it. Google likes it that way.

You don't have to replace the phone. You can go to some repair shop and get the battery replaced. It will be several times cheaper than a new phone. Very few people do that. I don't. Because a) general software enshittification makes me need a more powerful decice anyway, and, more importantly, b) people are just happy to have an excuse to get the the new shiny.

I do it.

> a) general software enshittification makes me need a more powerful decice anyway

You don't, this is nothing but an excuse for

> b) people are just happy to have an excuse to get the the new shiny.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#833

Post by nick486 »

good. now do the software enshittification part, which is the real driver of device obsolescence. being able to replace the battery is nice, but if the new battery lasts half as long because the software needs twice as much resources to perform the same tasks - you're not really fixing anything.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#835

Post by Aissen »

Aachen wrote: post #318
Aissen wrote: post #169

Next: replaceable storage? Since flash-based storage is widely known as a consumable that tends to fail first.

You mean the kind of "first" that comes right after shattered screens, worn batteries, and loose charging ports? :P I agree in spirit though: storage chips wearing out seems to be common from my limited experience and it would be good if you could solder on, or slide in, a new chip with some standard procedure

Screen, battery and charging port replacements are already routine at any repair shop, at least for the devices I buy.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#836

Post by argsnd »

denkmoon wrote: post #802
jillesvangurp wrote: post #778

I used to work for Nokia back when they still made phones. Replaceable batteries were very normal then. Phones were a bit thicker than today but not massively so. These days phones are actually thinner but much larger. I had a "are you happy to see me or is that a Nokia" type Nokia 9300. That was a brick. But it had a full hw keyboard. and flipped open it wasn't that much bigger than a modern smart phone. You could a…

If they filled that negative space my phone wouldn't rock annoyingly and sit awkwardly on flat surfaces, and that would be a great shame.

If you filled the negative space on an iPhone 17 Pro/Max it would be a horrendously unwieldy phone. People who say this stuff seriously underestimate the disastrous effect on ergonomics increasing the whole phone from 8.75mm to 13.2mm would have.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#837

Post by wonnage »

argsnd wrote: post #836
denkmoon wrote: post #802

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they filled that negative space my phone wouldn't rock annoyingly and sit awkwardly on flat surfaces, and that would be a great shame.

If you filled the negative space on an iPhone 17 Pro/Max it would be a horrendously unwieldy phone. People who say this stuff seriously underestimate the disastrous effect on ergonomics increasing the whole phone from 8.75mm to 13.2mm would have.

People already do this by buying cases

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#838

Post by vrganj »

loeber wrote: post #814
vrganj wrote: post #668

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not having cheap plastic junk that ends up as toxic landfill is a pro, not a con. "Cheap" isn't enough, especially if it's cheap through externalizing cost.

Say that to the people who can't afford them!

This is especially beneficial for poorer folks, who won't have to buy a whole new phone when a battery dies.

Plus, what you're talking about is a failure of socioeconomic policy, not one to be fixed by giving poor people junk.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#839

Post by kubb »

pllbnk wrote: post #809

I find it so weird that European regulation targets very specific niches while avoiding generalization. In order to reduce plastic pollution, they forced manufacturers to make attached bottle caps (terrible idea) but go to the supermarket and there are various fruits and vegetables each unit wrapped in plastic separately. Now they are targeting phones but I also want my handheld and robot vacuum cleaners, electric to…

I will never get the bottle cap haters. It’s a genuine improvement for me, and at most a minor inconvenience for anyone. Calling that a „terrible” idea makes you wonder what kind of scale you’re using, putting so much weight on something so minor.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#840

Post by bmicraft »

thelastgallon wrote: post #804
KingMachiavelli wrote: post #725

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is where peak battery tech ends up. At current capacities, batteries are becoming genuinely dangerous, and faster charging only amplifies the risk. Charging high-capacity cells outside a temperature-controlled charger is risky, and even reputable chargers shouldn't be left unattended — many workplaces ban it outright (it only takes one fire to make that policy). Phone batteries are the worst of it:…

We don't need fast charging. Phones will be left on wireless charging surfaces, which will eventually be ubiquitous. Everyone hates usb-c plug in. Just leave it on a surface, pick it whenever you want. We don't need to fast charge anything, phones or EVs. Slow charging preserves battery life and smart charging will charge whenever it is cheapest.

Charging a 5Ah phone empty to full every day of the year adds up to all of about 7kWh. Nobody cares if you shave off a couple cents per year if the experience is worse.
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