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Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

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21–30 of 42 posts

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#21

This isn't wisdom. It's mere cynicism that's trying to pass itself off as wisdom. >But society isn’t a building. Its parts are people, not struts or circuits. That is why a humanistic education is far more useful to the policymaker (and by extension, the citizen) than a technical one. Of course society isn't a building. Who was arguing that it was? But many of our problems are technical in nature, or, at the very lea…

Bravo sir.

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#23

This isn't wisdom. It's mere cynicism that's trying to pass itself off as wisdom. >But society isn’t a building. Its parts are people, not struts or circuits. That is why a humanistic education is far more useful to the policymaker (and by extension, the citizen) than a technical one. Of course society isn't a building. Who was arguing that it was? But many of our problems are technical in nature, or, at the very lea…

> It is not valid if your premises (e.g. all species on Earth were created by a divine intelligent designer) have been proven false. Sigh... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

How is taking one isolated sentence and pedantically linking to a Wikipedia that highlights a subtle error while missing or ignoring the obvious thrust of the entire argument in any way adding to this discussion? Come on now.

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#25
Politics is one thing that has been touched very little by technology. In fact, most of modern sovereign-state politics is run on 18th century enlightenment ideas. One would expect that people could be voting from the comfort of their homes, not just every 4 years, but a lot more often on matters that affect them directly, like local issues. Also, political discourse should not be based on putting on 2 shows on TV every 4 years. The internet is a great medium of discourse, and can be used to bring up the issues that really matter and the politicians that can actually deliver, instead of the ones willing to succumb to the powers that control media/big capital.

I am aware of very few platforms that use the internet for what it's best at: giving everyone a voice. Things like http://liquidfeedback.org/ are only a start. I would bet that if the right tool existed, you could base a whole government on it.

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#26

This isn't wisdom. It's mere cynicism that's trying to pass itself off as wisdom. >But society isn’t a building. Its parts are people, not struts or circuits. That is why a humanistic education is far more useful to the policymaker (and by extension, the citizen) than a technical one. Of course society isn't a building. Who was arguing that it was? But many of our problems are technical in nature, or, at the very lea…

> It is not valid if your premises (e.g. all species on Earth were created by a divine intelligent designer) have been proven false. Sigh... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

[deleted]

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is not valid if your premises (e.g. all species on Earth were created by a divine intelligent designer) have been proven false. Sigh... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

How is taking one isolated sentence and pedantically linking to a Wikipedia that highlights a subtle error while missing or ignoring the obvious thrust of the entire argument in any way adding to this discussion? Come on now.

seems he/she should be able to take apart an argument in any way he/she wants. It contributes to the conversation by pointing out another poorly thought out/worded/constructed argument. True, there are bigger fish to fry and more important points to address, but that doesn't have to be everyone's prerogative.

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#28

This isn't wisdom. It's mere cynicism that's trying to pass itself off as wisdom. >But society isn’t a building. Its parts are people, not struts or circuits. That is why a humanistic education is far more useful to the policymaker (and by extension, the citizen) than a technical one. Of course society isn't a building. Who was arguing that it was? But many of our problems are technical in nature, or, at the very lea…

"This isn't wisdom. It's mere cynicism that's trying to pass itself off as wisdom."

Not to mention a blatant strawman argument.

The author never even bothers to defend his argument against the obvious counterargument that perhaps the same kind of politicians, and the same kind of political thinking, that has failed to solve (or outright caused) so many major national problems is perhaps not worth trusting to solve them in the future, and that maybe a more pragmatic approach is needed.

From reading through some of his other pieces, I'm fairly certain that he doesn't know his subject well here. Does he seriously think that engineers think in binary and idolize Mr. Spock?

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is not valid if your premises (e.g. all species on Earth were created by a divine intelligent designer) have been proven false. Sigh... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

How is taking one isolated sentence and pedantically linking to a Wikipedia that highlights a subtle error while missing or ignoring the obvious thrust of the entire argument in any way adding to this discussion? Come on now.

It's not a subtle error, and it's not peripheral to the argument either.

The entire middle third of the comment is the standard engineer's fallacy that because the laws of physics are absolute and not relative, people's values should be also, and all conflict could be avoided if people were just rational. The main evidence offered is this aside about "science" "proving" the non-existence of god, so its fallaciousness is highly relevant. (There's also the fun of pointing out a fallacious and therefore irrational arugment in support of being rational, I'll admit it.)

Every college student in a technical major who has to take a humanities class for general ed goes through this phase, it's understandable. But it's just as important to grow up and leave it. Values are not rational, but that doesn't mean you get to ignore them.

Re: Mr. Fix It - The Engineer's Mentality in Politics

#30

The great irony is that in writing this, he exposes the fundamental conceit of the "poli-sci" complex that has brought the USA to its knees. The things he quotes as the reason poli-sci-types and not engineers should be the ones running government is that they learn "that people have different but equally valid perspectives; that the truth is not necessarily hard and precise; that judgments of value cannot be reduced…

While i'm fond of it, there is nothing like a proof that empiricism is right and everything else (even metaphysics) is wrong. That said, i also don't believe running a government is much different than organizing any other kind of hierarchy, be it of animals or machines, it's a sort of engineering. In that sense, the practice of turning everything to popularity/likability contests is at least baffling; yet there is nothing better than democracy, and people still believe in invisible hands, political or otherwise.
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