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CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

cyanogenmod.org

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Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#31

Post by jlgreco »

bnr wrote: post #14
omnisci wrote: post #12

I'm assuming people here know a bit more about this than I do, so I'll ask. Why is CM still a 3rd party developer? I'm curious as to why Google/Samsung/Motorola etc hasn't bought them out and applied their talent to make the stock setup better? Honestly, I'd much rather buy a "XYZ phone, CyanogenMod version" over to the stock Touchwiz/SenseUI etc front end. Excuse my ignorance if this is a dumb question.

Cyanogen, the initial author, was hired by Samsung some time ago. But CM is still a volunteer project, the developers don't get monetary compensation for their work, so there's nothing to buy out.

It should be fairly easy to "buy them out". Pick out the ones that do the most work and/or the work relevant to what you need done, and shoot them a letter with an NDA/check that offers them a contracting gig to get CM up and running on a device before launch.

They of course could keep on working on CM in general, and do contracting for other people as well, but at least your phone would have CM support out of the box.

I imagine the CM people could organize a bit to facilitate such contracting, but I suspect the reason this hasn't already been happening is that there just isn't really any demand from the manufacturers. I can't really say I know anything about the industry at all though, so I might just be talking crap.

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#32

Post by shimon_e »

runjake wrote: post #17
mindslight wrote: post #6

It really irks me that there are no builds for older devices. What is the point of installing CM and putting up with reduced and clunky functionality, just to be left by the wayside for updates? I don't know if this is due to CM or Google itself running amok on the upstream tree, but a philosophy that considers a two year old device obsolete is utterly preposterous.

You are fully welcome to contribute. CM isn't a commercial product, it lives because of its volunteers. You don't need to be a coder to help out. You can help out with documentation, helping people in the #cyanogenmod IRC channel, etc. These jobs free up CM developer time so they can work on code.

It would be in manufacturers interest to sponsor CM. It may even work out cheaper that maintaining their possibly less-competent/more-expensive in house teams.

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#33

Post by beagle3 »

mindslight wrote: post #24
andybak wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ubuntu is a commercial venture. It pays people salaries. You do the same to someone working on a CM ROM for your phone and I'm sure your request will be granted.

I only picked Ubuntu for a timely example. This philosophy has applied to the Linux kernel and Linux distributions for at least the past 15 years.

So, because Linux distribution packagers have been able to provide you with free timely updates, you expect Cyanogen team to do so too?

Why do you think you deserve anything?

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#34

Post by maratd »

mindslight wrote: post #24
andybak wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ubuntu is a commercial venture. It pays people salaries. You do the same to someone working on a CM ROM for your phone and I'm sure your request will be granted.

I only picked Ubuntu for a timely example. This philosophy has applied to the Linux kernel and Linux distributions for at least the past 15 years.

You're not listening. Linux on the PC works on pretty much any computer because Intel eradicated the competition. If you buy a new computer, you're almost certainly running an Intel chipset with an Intel CPU, and probably Intel graphics, NIC, etc.

That makes supporting the Linux kernel for computers relatively trivial.

This is not the case with mobile.

You have dozens of CPU variants for each generation. Nevermind the unique brew of components that goes into every different model even from the same manufacturer. Every phone needs at least one developer who spends his time maintaining the kernel and drivers for that phone for each and every update.

Now, follow along. Developers are nerds. Nerds like new and shiny things. The probability of any developer sticking around with an old phone is zero. Hence, no updates. If this is a problem, learn how to code and keep your obsolete hardware working. Nobody owes you anything. It's up to you.

The cyanogenmod project doesn't maintain any phones. They just help organize various developers who are interested in specific phones and combine their work into a cohesive product. No interest in a phone? No release for that phone.

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#35

Post by carlob »

dsr_ wrote: post #8
mindslight wrote: post #6

It really irks me that there are no builds for older devices. What is the point of installing CM and putting up with reduced and clunky functionality, just to be left by the wayside for updates? I don't know if this is due to CM or Google itself running amok on the upstream tree, but a philosophy that considers a two year old device obsolete is utterly preposterous.

Unofficial ports will happen. CM can only fully support devices where there is at least one developer who owns the device and is willing to do the work. All their work is in the open. Just the same as any other open source project: if you want it, you need to do some work or pay someone to do it for you.

There have been unofficial CM10 builds for other devices before the first official ones started.

I'm running a fairly stable one on my HTC for daily use.

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#36

Post by anonymouz »

mindslight wrote: post #6

It really irks me that there are no builds for older devices. What is the point of installing CM and putting up with reduced and clunky functionality, just to be left by the wayside for updates? I don't know if this is due to CM or Google itself running amok on the upstream tree, but a philosophy that considers a two year old device obsolete is utterly preposterous.

Others have already said that it's a community project and so YMMV with respect to older phones.

I have a Samsung Galaxy S (the first one). Since this phone has quite a following I got very lucky: CM has continuously been releasing updates for it, even though it's a very old phone by todays standards. I've been using CM7 on it, now have CM9 installed and am in the progress of upgrading to CM10. CyanogenMod's support for this phone has been awesome.

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#38

Post by rplnt »

maratd wrote: post #34
mindslight wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only picked Ubuntu for a timely example. This philosophy has applied to the Linux kernel and Linux distributions for at least the past 15 years.

You're not listening. Linux on the PC works on pretty much any computer because Intel eradicated the competition . If you buy a new computer, you're almost certainly running an Intel chipset with an Intel CPU, and probably Intel graphics, NIC, etc. That makes supporting the Linux kernel for computers relatively trivial. This is not the case with mobile. You have dozens of CPU variants for each generation . Nevermind…

The Intel CPU with AMD64 instruction set :)

Re: CyanogenMod 10.0 Release

#39

Post by mindslight »

maratd wrote: post #34
mindslight wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only picked Ubuntu for a timely example. This philosophy has applied to the Linux kernel and Linux distributions for at least the past 15 years.

You're not listening. Linux on the PC works on pretty much any computer because Intel eradicated the competition . If you buy a new computer, you're almost certainly running an Intel chipset with an Intel CPU, and probably Intel graphics, NIC, etc. That makes supporting the Linux kernel for computers relatively trivial. This is not the case with mobile. You have dozens of CPU variants for each generation . Nevermind…

No, I've been listening. It's just that nobody has been making any actual points besides 'stfu'. So thank you for bringing the discussion back to technicals.

Your point re: Intel peripherals is true today, but wasn't really true ten years ago. It's also a bit hard to talk about the Linux kernel today, as there is obviously a lot of money and other support such that every little piece is fully tended to by someone.

So my real question is why do the old drivers have to leave the tree or at least become perma deprecated? Is there that many breaking interface changes for which drivers cannot be mostly mechanically updated? I know this is a problem that the kernel devs managed just fine over the years (sure there's been individual broken drivers accompanying major changes, but there's a big difference between saying 'the latest kernel breaks your network card' and indefinitely unsupporting your entire computer.

Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong level of CM publishes (just the releases) and hence I'm out of touch on the actual status of "unsupported" workings on various devices.

And sheesh, the alleged entitlement is the same as with any open source project - I put my faith in the project and would like to continue doing so. I'm not asking for them to conjure up someone to magically do extra work to support my device, I'm asking why they don't change their process such that this extra work is unnecessary in the first place.

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