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All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

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Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#271

Post by perfunctory »

emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

> At the very least we'd need to see some data that shows that most people replace batteries when it is possible to do so.

I don’t understand. If we want to see the data we do need to make batteries replaceable.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#273

Post by ImPostingOnHN »

emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

> If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery".

If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby if they want their phone to have a replaceable battery, I don't think you would be there very long before receiving a "yes". I think that's a more honest framing of the question.

> I suppose someone will say that this law is necessary for environmental reasons, regardless of people's preferences. But that's nonsense, because the law doesn't actually require people to replace batteries rather than replacing their phone

How could they replace their batteries if they wanted to, unless the manufacturer makes it possible? The goal is not to force individuals to not replace their phones, but rather to provide that as an option at all, for those who want it.

> At the very least we'd need to see some data that shows that most people replace batteries when it is possible to do so.

At the very least, we'd need only data showing that that number is non-zero. From where did you get the idea that we need to prove "most" people would choose to take advantage of this option?

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#274

Post by cozzyd »

emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

It used to be true that it made sense to replace your phone every few years because new ones were so much better. But like... I have a Pixel 8 and there's not really anything in a newer phone that's compelling enough to spend any money on...

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#275

Post by oblio »

brk wrote: post #147
OutOfHere wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People shouldn't have to go to a special store or buy special tools requiring special skills to change a battery.

In a perfect world, sure. But people also want phones these days that are physically durable, have some degree of waterproofing/water resistance, maximum battery life, etc. Many of the demands and expectations of a modern phone aren't easily compatible with a replaceable battery design that can withstand the incompetence of the average end user.

We can make waterproof things that are attached with screws.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#276

Post by emtel »

afavour wrote: post #264
emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

I think that’s the wrong way of framing it. If, before the launch of the iPhone, you asked what people wanted from their phones you’d be there a very long time before anyone described something like an iPhone (no buttons, capacitive touch interface, etc). And yet, once they were offered it, people flocked to it. This regulation is targeted to devices with poor battery lives. Just because it hasn’t occurred to people…

That's an odd reply since by that argument they also flocked to a phone with no replaceable battery, which was pretty standard in the 2000s.

But you could be right. I guess this will be an experiment to watch: If EU consumers show a strong preference for replaceable batteries once they become more widely available, we can expect manufacturers to start offering it in other markets as well.

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#277

Post by ahartmetz »

emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

How about you ask people if they want a non-swappable battery for 1 mm less thickness?

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#278

Post by GuB-42 »

LazyMans wrote: post #220

This might be shifting us closer to worse overall design/performance to accommodate swapability. The pouch cells are very fragile, with the phone itself being the physical protection for the cell. If end users begin to handle these, you likely have to add additional packaging to the cell which increases the overall dimensions or reduces total capacity to maintain the same size. Maybe it's for our own good, maybe we h…

I am not sure people actually care that much about dimensions.

Most phones today only look thin on promotional material. With the massive camera bump that is sometimes thicker than the phone itself, and the way most people use cases, in the end, you have quite a brick. Also a glass back panel, which to me is one of the worst materials for that purpose, but it looks good on the store stand.

So to me, a removable battery will not affect the phone dimensions as much as it will affect the look, which may piss off the marketing guys, and I take it as a positive!

Seriously, bring back the removable plastic back covers, plastic may look cheap, but to me, it is the best material, and if you put on a case, as most people do, you won't even see it!

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#279

Post by fsflover »

kylehotchkiss wrote: post #246
pwdisswordfishq wrote: post #235

What good are replaceable batteries if the software becomes obsolete and un-upgradeable by the time you need to replace the battery?

the secondary market for old phones seems strong?

Because people don't understand the security implications of non-updated software?

Re: All phones sold in the EU to have replaceable batteries from 2027

#280

Post by elicash »

emtel wrote: post #258

One of the most frustrating things about HN is that people seem so unaware of how idiosyncratic their preferences are. If you stood on the street corner and asked every passerby what they would change about their phone, I think you would be there all day before someone said "I wish I could replace the battery". It's okay to have idiosyncratic preferences (I certainly do), but people should recognize that this law wil…

This doesn't require the battery to be replaceable. It requires either the battery to still be good after 1000 charges or for it to be replaceable, either one.

Although some of this depends on how you define replaceable.

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