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Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

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Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#71

Post by username44 »

cedws wrote: post #62
saadn92 wrote: post #29

I ran a private server years ago. Two things people in this thread are getting wrong: The engineering is way harder than anyone gives credit for. You're reverse engineering a server protocol from the client binary, writing your own spell systems (thousands of spells, each with edge cases), pathing, instancing, combat mechanics. Then scaling it for a few thousand concurrent players on hardware you're paying for out of…

On the client side how did they do this? I worked with a team reverse engineering another MMO a few years ago and it was because of a plain XML config and game launch args that we could make the client connect to a private server easily without modifications. Blizzard could just implement DRM and put an end to all this, right?

When I played on a private server, you used an old version of the client binary. So even if Blizzard implemented DRM now, it wouldn’t impact these old versions.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#72

Post by Chance-Device »

mmanfrin wrote: post #46
breakfastduck wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Valve aren't owned by private equity and other giant corporations so they make good decisions and do things fans like. A lot of their entire platform is built on mods they've bought and turned into proper 1st class games (cs, dota, Garys mod etc)

Their entire company owes its history to mods. HL's engine GoldDrc was originally a mod for Quake. Team Fortress Classic was based on a quake mod. Counterstrike was a HL mod they bought out. Portal was a student game they bought. Dota 2 was based on a WC3 map. Left 4 Dead was a mod made by Turtle Rock while working on CS:CZ (so, yet again a mod, although a mod based on their own engine this time and build in house).…

> HL's engine GoldDrc was originally a mod for Quake.

GoldSrc is based on Quake 1 code with valves own modifications and a little Quake 2 added in, if I remember correctly. I wouldn’t call that a “mod”, they bought a commercial license for the engine and made a game with it.

You’re trying to use this to say that valve are unoriginal? I really don’t think that’s a criticism you can lob at the half life series.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#73

Post by blanched »

10000truths wrote: post #68
crote wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that supposed to work when the main product is nostalgia? It's a mod for people who think the first-party expansions aren't true to the core of the original game - how could an independent game with completely new IP ever have the same draw? You really can't compare this to something like DotA, where the original engine and IP was basically set dressing for the new game built within it. People were primarily i…

It can work. Old School RuneScape runs almost entirely on nostalgia, but the community voting system they have for introducing new content keeps the game alive and fresh, even after 20 years.

Yes, but Jagex owns all of the IP there. Turtle can't use Warcraft's... world.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#74

Post by ViewTrick1002 »

drbscl wrote: post #67
charcircuit wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true. I think what you may be thinking of is many hit games did not create their own game engine.

Counter-Strike Every MOBA that exists (DotA, LoL, HoN, etc) Team Fortress Killing Floor PUBG Natural Selection Undoubtedly, many more that I can't recall off the top of my head.

Tower defense games.

Warcraft 3, the birthplace of so many amazing genres.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#75

Post by NekkoDroid »

charcircuit wrote: post #69
skupig wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ever heard of Dota 2? PUBG? Team Fortress 2?

None of those are mods. Dota 2 is its own game built on Source 2. PUBG used UE4. TF2 used Source.

They all started out as mods to games. DotA specifically was a Warcraft 3 mod and ended up making Blizzard change their stance on such things because they lost such a massive IP to a different company. PUBG started as an Arma 2 mod and TF was a Quake mod. All the mendioned games effectively have their origins in mods for other games and likely wouldn't exist (at least in the form they are today) if that weren't for that, is what they presumably were indicating.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#76

Post by charcircuit »

drbscl wrote: post #67
charcircuit wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true. I think what you may be thinking of is many hit games did not create their own game engine.

Counter-Strike Every MOBA that exists (DotA, LoL, HoN, etc) Team Fortress Killing Floor PUBG Natural Selection Undoubtedly, many more that I can't recall off the top of my head.

>Counter-Strike, Team Fortress, Natural Selection

These games used the GoldSrc engine. Any game built on this engine gets called a mod. But this is not what most people actually think of when people are talking about mods. Rust is not a mod of Unity. These are game engines that people built a game using.

>DotA

This was a custom map. Not a mod.

>LoL, HoN

These were built on in house game engines and were not a mod.

>PUBG

This game used UE4 and was not a mod.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#77

Post by NekkoDroid »

weberer wrote: post #59
packetslave wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nintendo is probably THE most aggressive company in the industry in terms of going after people for using their IP in unauthorized ways. They don't have a blind eye.

Yet Pokemon Showdown and Advance Wars By Web have been running for over a decade.

I am p sure Showdown only still exists because it would crater their official VGC league if they'd shut it down. And with Champions out now it is slightly more likely they would go after it, but they know that it isn't possible to iterate and test teams as fast in it as it is in Showdown (and I doubt they plan on changing that considering the limitations seem very intentional).

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#78

Post by AngryData »

idiotsecant wrote: post #41
breakfastduck wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Valve aren't owned by private equity and other giant corporations so they make good decisions and do things fans like. A lot of their entire platform is built on mods they've bought and turned into proper 1st class games (cs, dota, Garys mod etc)

I feel like every large public corporation inevitably turns into a rent seeking parasite. How do we build a system that has more calves and fewer blizzards? How do we incentivize that?

You gotta give capitalist first principles and ideals and policies the boot. When you can use money to buy anything and earn money without practical limits, gaining access to more and more capital at any and all costs, even at the cost of everybody else's life and freedom and rights, is the natural result.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#79

Post by evilduck »

charcircuit wrote: post #69
skupig wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ever heard of Dota 2? PUBG? Team Fortress 2?

None of those are mods. Dota 2 is its own game built on Source 2. PUBG used UE4. TF2 used Source.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psyonix

Rocket League was a sequel to Super Sonic Rocket Powered Battle Cars which was a totally new game but born from the studio building VehicleMod for Unreal Tournament.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#80

Post by pseudo0 »

charcircuit wrote: post #70
danschuller wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No many hit games started as mods. League of Legends is the one that immediately jumps to mind, but I know there are many more coming from Quake and Doom mods etc.

League of Legends is its own game built on an engine Riot made from scratch.

League's Wikipedia page describes it as "inspired by Defense of the Ancients, a custom map for Warcraft III." I believe they also hired some of the core Dota devs to work on League. I guess if you want to be pedantic it was a custom map, but that was more a consequence of WC3 lacking support for mods. They ended up having to work around a lot of limitations to make Dota work in the custom map framework.
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