Live data from Hacker News

The Little Coder's Predicament

whytheluckystiff.net

71–80 of 107 posts

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#71
Unfortunately Handykey (makers of the Twiddler) are out of business for the time being. Fortunately, there is some work in our lab along with Chris George, founder of Handykey, to build a Bluetooth version of the Twiddler that follows the Bluetooth HCID Profile.

http://wiki.cc.gatech.edu/ccg/classes/7470/7470-f06/bluetoot...

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We care on the XNA team as well! It's not bundled, but you can develop for your Xbox 360! http://creators.xna.com/ C# Express, Game Studio, and XNA Framework are free for personal and commercial use on Windows. Deploying to your Xbox 360 costs $99/year which includes the rights to sell your games on Xbox Live. The download includes a simple Platformer game "starter kit" (written by yours truly) which is perfect for g…

Why isn't it free to deploy to your Xbox and then $99 for the ability to sell your game?

I'd love the ability to deploy my little learning-iPhone-SDK apps to my iPhone (to get the 'oh wow' feeling that I built something) but that's going to require $99 and getting a provisioning certificate from Apple. And in fact, I may pay the $99, just to be able to do this (not necessarily to sell apps).

I believe that Apple and MSFT did this licensing fee program to stop any sort of homebrew movement (e.g. people sharing games outside of the approved ecosystem). They came from Homebrew but that's in the Cambrian age for them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homebrew_Computer_Club

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#73
post #61
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If you could get rid of these barriers..." What you don't think there are enough ridiculously bad programmers using PHP/javascript already? Barriers to entry are good . It sorts the people who really want to do it because they love it, from the rest.

OK, perhaps I should have written a bit more here. The issue is, there is pretty much no barrier at all to programming at the moment. That's why there are so many bad programmers who have just heard there's money to be made. Add to that the fact that identifying bad programmers is sometimes hard, and you have a bad situation. Raise that barrier for entry, and perhaps someone who thinks "Wow there's money to be made i…

I think a better solution is to have an incredibly low barrier to entry (never know if you are a good programmer until you try it, so getting more people to try means more good programmers), and then focusing on improving your programmer selection (if you are hiring). If a bad programmer can't get a job, then they will most likely find another path in life. (If they keep writing bad code for themselves, who cares?)

As far as open source is concerned, bad programmers don't bother me, because you can generally find a solution written by someone that is good.

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#74
post #38
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seemed to the obvious answer to me. Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft aren't going to open up development on their consoles because they make money off of licensing fees.

Unless they disallowed vendors from charging for games made by the "open" dev kit, thereby preserving the licensing fee. Or just eliminate the fee in its entirety and take a slice of the revenue (or marginally larger slice). I don't see how lowering cost of entry could be anything but advantageous to console makers.

On the first thought: I don't see it,they would still have to contend with a growing community of people who mostly want to play homebrew and open source games.

On the second: Maybe, but that might be seen as a barrier to publishing a game made for fun that just happened to be good. "Eh, I'll just give it away, I was only doing it for fun anyway."

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#75
As _why alludes to, I think the best work being done in this area is by Alan Kay and his work with Squeak in the squeakland project: http://www.squeakland.org/

I think it could easily be ported to a variety of platforms.

And _why's totally right. My 8-bit sprite of a jumping cow for Logo was the sweetest (yes, C64's in Texas, that explains a lot about the jumping cow).

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#76
post #61
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If you could get rid of these barriers..." What you don't think there are enough ridiculously bad programmers using PHP/javascript already? Barriers to entry are good . It sorts the people who really want to do it because they love it, from the rest.

OK, perhaps I should have written a bit more here. The issue is, there is pretty much no barrier at all to programming at the moment. That's why there are so many bad programmers who have just heard there's money to be made. Add to that the fact that identifying bad programmers is sometimes hard, and you have a bad situation. Raise that barrier for entry, and perhaps someone who thinks "Wow there's money to be made i…

I think you sort of missed the point of _why's original article, though. He's not lamenting the difficulty for computer-savvy adults to get started programming -- the main thrust of his article is towards our failure to provide an easy-to-use, freely-included sandbox for kids to experiment with programming.

How many of the other folks here started out just as described in this article: namely, writing silly little BASIC programs for early Commodore, Apple, or DOS systems?

There are a handful of projects aimed at just this niche (Scratch and Greenfoot, for example) but none of them come standard on any new system. That lack of immediate availability means that kids have to actively seek out the tools + have the ability/privileges to install new software before they can even start experimenting with something like this:

  10 PRINT "JENNY HAS COOTIES!"
  20 GOTO 10

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We care on the XNA team as well! It's not bundled, but you can develop for your Xbox 360! http://creators.xna.com/ C# Express, Game Studio, and XNA Framework are free for personal and commercial use on Windows. Deploying to your Xbox 360 costs $99/year which includes the rights to sell your games on Xbox Live. The download includes a simple Platformer game "starter kit" (written by yours truly) which is perfect for g…

Why isn't it free to deploy to your Xbox and then $99 for the ability to sell your game?

[deleted]

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#78
post #76
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, perhaps I should have written a bit more here. The issue is, there is pretty much no barrier at all to programming at the moment. That's why there are so many bad programmers who have just heard there's money to be made. Add to that the fact that identifying bad programmers is sometimes hard, and you have a bad situation. Raise that barrier for entry, and perhaps someone who thinks "Wow there's money to be made i…

I think you sort of missed the point of _why's original article, though. He's not lamenting the difficulty for computer-savvy adults to get started programming -- the main thrust of his article is towards our failure to provide an easy-to-use, freely-included sandbox for kids to experiment with programming. How many of the other folks here started out just as described in this article: namely, writing silly little BA…

On any Mac said kid could do:

    $ python
    >>> while True:
    >>>     print "JENNY HAS COOTIES!"
No installations, no extra privileges, nothing. It just works. _why is tilting at windmills.

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#79
The predicament presented is not new since there has always (in my geek lifetime at least) been a division between "computing" devices and "gaming" devices.

Yes, I too learned programming on my TI99/4A and Aquarius and Laser 128 but then I also played games on my Intellivision without a way of trying my code there.

I always saw hacking on my computer as a "gateway" (no pun intended) to creating more advanced programs in much the same way as playing backyard football was a "gateway" to playing professional football (if I was good enough).

Finally, it seems to me that the ultra-portable laptop revolution will be the driver of getting more "computing" devices into the hands of future generations.

Re: The Little Coder's Predicament

#80
post #50

As a general note, consumers are not supposed to fiddle with the product , since customizations are supposed to be sold as services related to the mass market item. Exploration and learning should be restricted as much as possible (see Digital Restrictions Management, and the Right to Read). But then again, dumbing down consumers does fire back in the end... So when users do finally get to program, the supported way…

I know you're being flippant, but there really is a critical underlying problem with making everyday technology intentionally arcane. If people are unable to easily learn how something works, they will, for all intents and purposes, treat things as black boxes or "magic" and learn to distrust them (and those who do understand them) when things go wrong. This problem isn't unique to computing. My father grew up in an…

It has been well articulated (with some of the consequences) in James Burkes' Connection series during the "good old days" of the beeb.

Would people know why is it cold inside the fridge, while it is hot outside? Or what makes the cold stay inside the box? Nevertheless, almost everybody relies on a fridge ...and almost nobody knows what actually it is. Tricky situation indeed on the long run...

Somebody has made the series available on:

http://www.youtube.com/profile_play_list?user=JamesBurkeFan

but the account has been closed. There are some traces on:

http://www.youtube.com/user/JamesBurkeWeb

You might like it: it is worth every minute.

Post reply on HN