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Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

freebsdfoundation.github.io

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Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#161

Post by fl4regun »

sausagefeet wrote: post #118
fl4regun wrote: post #108

So can anyone give me a short explanation on why someone would use freeBSD over linux? I do run it technically, on my router (OPNSense), but that's not a personal computer, like a desktop or laptop. What are the advantages to running FreeBSD?

I have a few reasons: 1. I subjectively just like it better. Things like dtrace, jails, the init system, just click for me. 2. I think it's good to not support a Linux mono-culture. Yes, there is Windows and macOS, but in terms of open source OS's, I think it's good to have more than one choice and so for any rough edges in FreeBSD, I'm willing to deal with them to support that goal. 3. I don't think you'll find any…

I use arch, but I don't see the distro as mattering that much. For the most part it just feels like picking your poison on which init system, what package manager you want to use, etc, but the end experience isn't too different once everything is set up. I can run steam on each one, they all have gcc, they all have support for the same set of desktop environments, they all have chrome/ff/whatever browser you want. At this point I'm just using what I have set up because the setup is what takes most of the effort, once that's done, it's smooth sailing.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#162

Post by jmspring »

josephg wrote: post #159
jmspring wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CUDA gets into an area that I wouldn't use it for. My local LLM machine is running Void linux.

Yes; linux is generally supported better than freebsd. CUDA and Docker work out of the box on linux. Linux has better graphics drivers and steam support. Opensource software (libraries, tools) are much more likely to be tested & work properly on linux. I've also run into several rust crates which don't build on freebsd - particularly crates which depend on C code. But the comment you're replying to said there weren't…

FreeBSD's development philosophy, it's aversion to design decisions like - we must allow systemd everywhere, stability, zfs and jails, consistent configuration (for decades) are all technical reasons I prefer it over Linux.

How about Ubuntu and snaps? License needed for certain security updates, etc.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#163

Post by nosioptar »

vermaden wrote: post #100

I own these and they also work great with FreeBSD: ThinkPads: - W520/W530/T520/T530/X220/X230/T420s - T480 - T14 GEN1 (Intel) - T14 GEN1 (AMD) I needed to replace MediaTek WiFi card on T14 (AMD) into some Intel WiFi one. Hope that helps. Regards, vermaden

That's quite helpful. I'm potentially switching my x220t and t530 to a BSD this year, might also get a gen 1 t14.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#164

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

bluebarbet wrote: post #126
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. And all of those devices run Linux. Some of them even run other Linux OSs decently; one of my daily drivers is an ARM Chromebook running postmarketos.

It is not trivial to get FOSS Linux onto a write-protected Intel Chromebook, compared to a Windows netbook of yore. It is harder still to get it onto an ARM Chromebook or Android tablet. PostmarketOS is a bit simpler (or at least better documented) but it is not a full Linux distro. Installing a fully-fledged FOSS OS on low-end general-purpose computing hardware is getting harder. Certainly for the non-techies who ha…

I think it's better and worse in slightly different ways. On the one hand, yeah a Chromebook won't let you touch the default OS without switching to developer mode, and won't let you install a new OS without disabling the write-protect screw or firmware option. On the other hand, every ChromeOS device allows you to do exactly that, and then you can run whatever you want and you should have at least some support for upstream Linux because ChromeOS upstreams their drivers. (I will happily agree that the Android device situation is awful.)

> PostmarketOS is a bit simpler (or at least better documented) but it is not a full Linux distro.

By what definition is PMOS not a "full" distro? It's Alpine plus some extra stuff, including device tweaks and out-of-the-box desktop environments.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#165

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

stackghost wrote: post #157
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> OpenBSD zealots claiming it's 110% secure because trust me bro Or possibly because it has a good track record. If you'd like to point at actual vulnerabilities go ahead.

>Or possibly because it has a good track record. "Only two remote code execution vulns in the default install" isn't saying much, because the default install has essentially no functionality. Similarly, RCE is not the only kind of vuln. Let's just say it is not the mainstream consensus that OpenBSD is meaningfully more secure than an up-to-date linux. This may have been true in 1995, but it's generally acknowledged b…

> because the default install has essentially no functionality

I dunno, it's got a built in HTTP/S web server and everything needed to be VPN or router.

> Let's just say it is not the mainstream consensus that OpenBSD is meaningfully more secure than an up-to-date linux. This may have been true in 1995, but it's generally acknowledged by people who know what they're talking about that OpenBSD's reputation for security is overstated.

Yes, I've read plenty of vague aspersions that it's totally not as secure as claimed. Since those claims never come with evidence, I'm going with the traditional response: PoC||GTFO.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#166

Post by autoexec »

vermaden wrote: post #100

I own these and they also work great with FreeBSD: ThinkPads: - W520/W530/T520/T530/X220/X230/T420s - T480 - T14 GEN1 (Intel) - T14 GEN1 (AMD) I needed to replace MediaTek WiFi card on T14 (AMD) into some Intel WiFi one. Hope that helps. Regards, vermaden

Buying a thinkpad means using a device made by Lenovo, a company which has repeatedly shipped devices infected with malware and backdoors (sometimes for profit) see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenovo#Security_and_privacy_in...

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#167

Post by assimpleaspossi »

fl4regun wrote: post #108

So can anyone give me a short explanation on why someone would use freeBSD over linux? I do run it technically, on my router (OPNSense), but that's not a personal computer, like a desktop or laptop. What are the advantages to running FreeBSD?

Use Google and you will find your same question has been asked 1000x1000 times every day for 30 years.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#168

Post by assimpleaspossi »

supliminal wrote: post #65

Yeah you run into this head on trying to use BSD. It’s too much glue and compat work. By the end of it you no longer have a coherent system, you’re back to Linux. I use FBSD on an old-ish Lenovo W540 without too many hiccups. No, it’s not for everyone and never was. I wouldn’t suggest to anyone to run a BSD as a daily driver, or at all, unless they have a good reason to. Once you cross that line you need to know what…

So you use FreeBSD on your laptop. You think people with reason should run it. You agree with others who have said you need to know the system to use it, and you do. So why does your response sound like you don't like it? I think you do cause you do.

One of the guys on the FreeBSD forums said, "FreeBSD is for professionals and serious computer enthusiasts." and I don't see anything wrong with that.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#169

Post by assimpleaspossi »

sunshine-o wrote: post #44

I personally feel like the race to support a vast array of hardware is very costly for such a small team and might be a waste of their precious resources. Of course I love FreeBSD and want it to be supported on my desktop or laptop but at what cost? Here is the question I have always wanted to ask: Why not make the ultimate compromise and say: you will be able to run FreeBSD on almost all laptops but it is gonna be t…

It's already done through the linuxalator. You run Linux applications through that. Or you can run Linux through bhyve.

Re: Top laptops to use with FreeBSD

#170

Post by bxparks »

mmsc wrote: post #57
bxparks wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the link: "Note: The inbuilt WiFi chip is not natively supported by FreeBSD, so you will need to (temporarily) use a USB WiFi or Ethernet dongle, or (as I will explain) copy some files from a different system to the Macbook. You could also just transplant a different chip into the system." You say "works perfectly". I do not think it means what you think it means. To be fair, Linux also has trouble with the Broa…

> You say "works perfectly". I do not think it means what you think it means. Copying some files from a different machine is not that burdensome. The point is, it works.

I was mostly objecting to the "perfectly" part. And I couldn't resist making a Princess Bride reference for amusement.
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