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Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

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Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#271

Post by ljf »

everdrive wrote: post #231

It's hard for me to understand why people choose to walk around in public wearing headphones. I'm aware that it's incredibly common, but you put yourself at risk of theft, accident, and of course the mild hearing loss that accompanies _any_ frequent headphone usage. In the case of both theft and accident, you cannot hear your assailant coming, and miss the queues that would otherwise keep you safe.

Same reason I listen to music or podcasts in the car.

I am very lucky to live in a city/country where risks of theft from my person is low - when I lived for 20 years in London I never once felt unsafe listening to music.

The closest was two young men got very close to me on the tube, when I was playing on my brand new Hong Kong imported PSP - but I just took my headphones off. I think they were just interested as most people hadn't seem one in the flesh yet.

I can't say I know of anyone personally who suffered theft or accident caused by them listening to music on headphones.

When I cycled a lot, I had a small speaker strapped to my handlebars rather than wearing headphones, as I liked being able to hear cars around me - but when I was younger I regularly cycled in headphones, and was still able to hear enough of the road around me to not feel that I was missing anything.

Remember, we don't make drivers drive around with no music and their windows open, so that they are better able to hear cyclists...

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#272

Post by afandian »

WastedCucumber wrote: post #233
afandian wrote: post #150

Cool idea. But bizarre that they worked with Deliveroo. Bike bells were designed for a time when cyclists travelled at speeds where you could safely get out of the way. Most "independent" cyclists do cycle safely. But delivery riders for delivery platforms commonly use illegally modified e-bikes. Platforms have the GPS data. They must know. They could make huge improvements in safety by actively preventing the use of…

>They could make huge improvements in safety by actively preventing the use of illegally modified e-bikes that travel too fast. Or by regulating bicycle food delivery services so thatheir employees' continued employment and wage magnitude doesn't hinge quite so thoroughly on how rapidly they deliver.

Yes, absolutely that.

I nearly put a passive aggressive "employees" in my post, but that would mix concerns. But having drivers as "contractors", and dodging employers' responsibilities and liabilities, is really the root of this all.

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#273

Post by everdrive »

chimpanzee2 wrote: post #232
everdrive wrote: post #231

It's hard for me to understand why people choose to walk around in public wearing headphones. I'm aware that it's incredibly common, but you put yourself at risk of theft, accident, and of course the mild hearing loss that accompanies _any_ frequent headphone usage. In the case of both theft and accident, you cannot hear your assailant coming, and miss the queues that would otherwise keep you safe.

> and of course the mild hearing loss that accompanies _any_ frequent headphone usage curious, you got any citations for this claim?

"Loud" is a bit subjective, but in my experience most people make their volume far too loud. Even moreso if you're attempting to overcome the background sound around you.

The articles below discuss both volume and duration. It's also worth checking out the OSHA guidelines which pretty cleanly show the relationship between duration and volume. (ie, "safer" volumes still cause damage with enough duration.)

https://health.clevelandclinic.org/how-to-rock-out-with-ear-...

https://healthcare.utah.edu/healthfeed/2024/01/listen-headph...

https://www.cnet.com/health/wearing-headphones-right-now-fol...

https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/noise/prevent/understand.html

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#274

Post by Heliosmaster »

walletdrainer wrote: post #198
eigenspace wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still think that ringing bells at people is a little rude, regardless of the tone. Like imagine if you were at the grocery store, blocking the isle and someone lightly chimed a bell at you instead of just saying "excuse me". IMO if I'm in a dense pedestrian zone and I can't go around people and I can't communicate by voice, it means I'm going too fast.

>blocking the isle and someone lightly chimed a bell at you instead of just saying "excuse me". Well, at least here in Europe I’d have to spend a decent amount of time deciding which language to use.

I just shout "dreen dreen".. which more or less is the sound a bike bell makes, works anywhere

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#275

Post by jmull »

eigenspace wrote: post #126
0x3f wrote: post #116

Do horns and bells really prevent accidents? In order for e.g. a horn to work you need enough time that the driver processes the situation and decides the horn will communicate something AND enough time for the pedestrian or whatever to process that and react to it. Generally it's a lot easier just to press the brake, and more importantly be travelling at a speed and in a manner where the brake is sufficient. Structu…

A horn or bell is mostly for telling other people "hey I'm here, stay out of my way and dont suddenly cross into my path" My opinion as a cyclist is that I should basically only be using my bell on pedestrians when the pedestrians are wandering onto the bike lane. If im cycling through a shared space, I find it extremely rude to ring the bell, because it feels like I'm telling people to get out of my way, but they ha…

Agreed.

I saw one recently where the cyclist shouted out something like, "ON YOUR LEFT!" and all it did was startle the crap out of a jogger who spun around into the path of the bicycle. Luckily just a close call. That cyclist's "warnings", with no time for pedestrians to react properly, were really just a game of Russian roulette. (And really rude, as you say).

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#276

Post by lostlogin »

recursive wrote: post #267
eigenspace wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still think that ringing bells at people is a little rude, regardless of the tone. Like imagine if you were at the grocery store, blocking the isle and someone lightly chimed a bell at you instead of just saying "excuse me". IMO if I'm in a dense pedestrian zone and I can't go around people and I can't communicate by voice, it means I'm going too fast.

Pedestrians still exist in non dense zones. It seems there's no way to win. I've been told that I should use a bell because vocal addresses are too startling. Now if there's not enough room to pass safely and silently I completely slow to the pedestrians speed and THEN calmly say excuse me. But I'm convinced that there is just no universally correct way to do it. If you pass people in any way whatsoever, sooner or la…

A noisy free hub is my solution.

Back peddling or coasting gets people’s attention. Though moving slowly uphill and needing to back peddle is a bit of a test.

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#277

Post by lostlogin »

jwr wrote: post #203
eigenspace wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A horn or bell is mostly for telling other people "hey I'm here, stay out of my way and dont suddenly cross into my path" My opinion as a cyclist is that I should basically only be using my bell on pedestrians when the pedestrians are wandering onto the bike lane. If im cycling through a shared space, I find it extremely rude to ring the bell, because it feels like I'm telling people to get out of my way, but they ha…

> A horn or bell is mostly for telling other people "hey I'm here, stay out of my way and dont suddenly cross into my path" This. I only use the bell on bike paths, too. Sometimes it feels like a game of pac-man, where baddies will wander into my path from all directions and in all kinds of ways. Cars doing a right turn, zombies staring into phones, people walking backwards (!), zombies staring into phones walking ba…

The ultimate cyclist killer: those stupid extending dog leashes.

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#278

Post by prmoustache »

walletdrainer wrote: post #166
eigenspace wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A horn or bell is mostly for telling other people "hey I'm here, stay out of my way and dont suddenly cross into my path" My opinion as a cyclist is that I should basically only be using my bell on pedestrians when the pedestrians are wandering onto the bike lane. If im cycling through a shared space, I find it extremely rude to ring the bell, because it feels like I'm telling people to get out of my way, but they ha…

> If im cycling through a shared space, I find it extremely rude to ring the bell, because it feels like I'm telling people to get out of my way, but they have just as much right to a shared path as I do. It’s certainly rude to ring the bell in a aggressive manner, but many bells are capable of producing much softer, more polite sounds. In super busy old European capitals I find that people increasingly just ride aro…

> In super busy old European capitals I find that people increasingly just ride around with speakers playing a constant tune at a reasonable volume, a massive improvement on dense streets full of varyingly sober people.

I sometimes do that. It helps not having music that could be described as aggressive. I often use reggae.

However it means you need a speaker charged so it is not something I have ready everytime I use my bicycle, nor do I want to carry it everyday when leaving the bike attached somewhere so it can't be the goto solution.

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#279

Post by empyrrhicist »

eigenspace wrote: post #126
0x3f wrote: post #116

Do horns and bells really prevent accidents? In order for e.g. a horn to work you need enough time that the driver processes the situation and decides the horn will communicate something AND enough time for the pedestrian or whatever to process that and react to it. Generally it's a lot easier just to press the brake, and more importantly be travelling at a speed and in a manner where the brake is sufficient. Structu…

A horn or bell is mostly for telling other people "hey I'm here, stay out of my way and dont suddenly cross into my path" My opinion as a cyclist is that I should basically only be using my bell on pedestrians when the pedestrians are wandering onto the bike lane. If im cycling through a shared space, I find it extremely rude to ring the bell, because it feels like I'm telling people to get out of my way, but they ha…

> Some cyclists ring their bells because they're worried a pedestrian might suddenly turn into their path,

This is wrong - on mixed use paths, it is customary and proper to announce "on your left" when passing, and a bell is a nice alternative. Even cycling slowly pedestrians can do some very erratic things, and moreover are very surprised when cyclists suddenly appear on their left (and may do something dumb in surprise!).

Re: Škoda DuoBell: A bicycle bell that penetrates noise-cancelling headphones

#280

Post by tonyedgecombe »

f3d46600-b66e wrote: post #258
michh wrote: post #234

Coincidentally, I bought a 12v car horn yesterday with the intent of wiring it into my ebike's power supply with a little button on my handlebars. Not because of other cyclists or pedestrians wearing (anc) headphones but because modern cars are so heavily sound-proofed they don't hear a bicycle bell anymore. A recent incident with an inattentive taxi driver in a brand new EV nearly flattening me prompted me to want t…

I did that, but I used battery - couldn't figure out how to hook up to the e-bike's 50v electrical system (plus the DC-DC converter with high enough current...) So I am using LiPo 3S, 2200mAh. Works like a charm. I keep it at its storage voltage (3.7-3.8v per cell), and it hardly drained the battery (there is no paracitic drain). Whole thing was like $20.

I pondered doing that but thought it would agitate other road users so decided against.
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