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F-15E jet shot down over Iran

theguardian.com

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Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And CENTCOM's lying about it. https://x.com/CENTCOM/status/2039805134704660622

Hate to say it and sound so "conspiracy-like", but I no longer can trust what the current US administration is saying. Ever since the path of a hurricane was redrawn with a sharpie, it's been... unusual.

Your comment is a perfect setup for the cynicism olympics where people rush to say you could never trust the govt.

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#112
post #44
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is assuming Iran holds itself to the Geneva conventions, which ... seems like an extremely risky bet to make.

Why wouldn't they?

First: count the responses to my thread of people suggesting Iran cannot/should not be held to the Geneva convention: 4,5 (I'm counting the Hegseth comment as 0.5)

The point is there are a great deal of people, even in the US, who advocate that it is unreasonable to hold people fighting the west in general and US in particular to the Geneva conventions. I don't know where this idea comes from, because morally it is of course indefensible, but there you go.

I would expect the number to be bigger in Iran. I would expect the number among IRGC extremists to be even higher than in Iran in general.

Second: war crimes have 2 interpretations. First as violations of the Rome treaty which require that the state where the warcrimes happen has signed the Rome treaty. Iran hasn't.

The second interpretation of warcrimes is that they are violations of the Geneva conventions, and the reaction would be that the UN security council intervenes. Well, the UNSC has preemptively declared they will not hold Iran to account for warcrimes (to be exact: France, Russia and China have declared they will veto). So at minimum you can say that Iranian warcrimes will not have any "official" consequences.

The world and the UN have decided that warcrimes "don't count". As in there will not be any consequences unless the government of the country where they happened implements those consequences.

Third: Iran has already kidnapped a US civilian (a reporter, Shelly Kittleson) and are holding her hostage. This is already a violation of the Geneva convention. They have also kidnapped hundreds of foreign nationals of other nations and are also holding them for ransom, which is also a violation of human rights, ie. a warcrime.

So those are my three reasons Iran won't hold itself to human rights standards.

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And CENTCOM's lying about it. https://x.com/CENTCOM/status/2039805134704660622

Hate to say it and sound so "conspiracy-like", but I no longer can trust what the current US administration is saying. Ever since the path of a hurricane was redrawn with a sharpie, it's been... unusual.

That has been (rightly) said every year there has been a current US administration.

It is not a conspiracy theory if it's true.

And no, it's not "cynicism Olympics", it's observation.

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hate to say it and sound so "conspiracy-like", but I no longer can trust what the current US administration is saying. Ever since the path of a hurricane was redrawn with a sharpie, it's been... unusual.

That has been (rightly) said every year there has been a current US administration. It is not a conspiracy theory if it's true. And no, it's not "cynicism Olympics", it's observation.

Right on cue!

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#116
During the entire gulf war (Iraq, 1990-91), only two F-15s were shot down via surface-to-air engagement. At the time, Baghdad was known to have the highest density of SAM protection out of any city in the world.

An F-15 being shot down in Iran after weeks of strategic bombing of their anti-air defense systems is not a good sign.

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hate to say it and sound so "conspiracy-like", but I no longer can trust what the current US administration is saying. Ever since the path of a hurricane was redrawn with a sharpie, it's been... unusual.

Your comment is a perfect setup for the cynicism olympics where people rush to say you could never trust the govt.

Has there been a time where (after later facts came out) they were wrong?

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#118
post #65
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hegseth is not in charge of the Iranian military.

But he did publicly declare his intention to commit war crimes.

In case anyone else doubted this, I will save you the time to look it up. Yup, it's sadly true.

https://www.commondreams.org/news/hegseth-no-quarter-interna...

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And CENTCOM's lying about it. https://x.com/CENTCOM/status/2039805134704660622

That tweet is from yesterday. Iran tweets about taking down an American jet basically daily. By their count we are down 40 f-35s, 4 aircraft carriers and thousands of MQ-9s.

And they have not edited it or taken it down... why?

Re: F-15E jet shot down over Iran

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That tweet is from yesterday. Iran tweets about taking down an American jet basically daily. By their count we are down 40 f-35s, 4 aircraft carriers and thousands of MQ-9s.

> That tweet is from yesterday. That's when the shootdown happened, yes. > Iran tweets about taking down an American jet basically daily. Sure. We have two sets of demonstrable liars here. See, for example, the E-3 Sentry that got blown up; it took leaked photos for that to be admitted. And don't get me started on the several times in the last few months we've "obliterated" Iran's nuclear capacity and missiles and wh…

The claim being addressed is a shootdown over Qeshm island, which is the biggest island just west of the strait of Hormuz. The current CSAR operations are happening somewhere in the Khuzestan province. Probably somewhere within the 150 km radius of [1] based on online footage of the C-130 flying over.

[1] 31.941606, 50.311765

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