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ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

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Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#121

Post by lxgr »

onion2k wrote: post #19
lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

Is that because botnets spoof being Firefox? It's not really fair to blame Cloudflare it is. That's on the bots.

No, using a stupid authentication/verification method with lots of false positives is always on whoever deploys it.

Imagine an apartment building with a flimsy front door lock that breaks all the time, and the landlord only telling you that that can't be helped because of all the burglars.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#122

Post by binaryturtle »

lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

I'm with a slightly older Firefox and can't use many websites at all anymore because the Cloudflare cancer.

Of course then you got sites like gnu.org too that block you because your slightly outdated user agent.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#123

Post by lxgr »

gruez wrote: post #38
doctaj wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way would that not be fair? Their product giving false positives (unnecessary challenges for a normal browser humans commonly use) to real people is definitely their fault.

>Their product giving false positives (unnecessary challenges for a normal browser humans commonly use) to real people is definitely their fault. Is it TSA's "fault" that non-terrorists are subject to screening?

No, but it's entirely within TSA's hands to make that process as frictionless as possible.

(It's a different question whether zero friction is actually desired, or whether some security theater is actually part of the service being provided, but that's a different question.)

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#124

Post by huertouisj »

MyNameIsNickT wrote: post #49

Hey! I'm Nick, and I work on Integrity at OpenAI. These checks are part of how we protect our first-party products from abuse like bots, scraping, fraud, and other attempts to misuse the platform. A big reason we invest in this is because we want to keep free and logged-out access available for more users. My team’s goal is to help make sure the limited GPU resources are going to real users. We also keep a very close…

sometimes I paste giant texts (think summarization) in the chatgpt (paid) webapp and I noticed that the CPU fans spin up for about 5 seconds after, as if the text is "processed" client side somehow. this is before hitting "submit" to send the prompt to the model.

I assumed it was maybe some tokenization going on client side, but now I realize maybe it's some proof of work related to prompt length?

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#125

Post by rglullis »

MyNameIsNickT wrote: post #49

Hey! I'm Nick, and I work on Integrity at OpenAI. These checks are part of how we protect our first-party products from abuse like bots, scraping, fraud, and other attempts to misuse the platform. A big reason we invest in this is because we want to keep free and logged-out access available for more users. My team’s goal is to help make sure the limited GPU resources are going to real users. We also keep a very close…

I shouldn't be giving ideas to your boss, but I bet he would be interested in making ChatGPT available only by paying customers or free for those whose who gets their eyes scanned by The Orb. Give 30 days of raised limits and we're all set to live in the dystopia he wants.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#126

Post by josephcsible »

onion2k wrote: post #19
lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

Is that because botnets spoof being Firefox? It's not really fair to blame Cloudflare it is. That's on the bots.

If it's just as easy to spoof being Chrome as it is to spoof being Firefox, then it is indeed fair to blame Cloudflare if they give Firefox users more CAPTCHAs than Chrome users.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#128

Post by lxgr »

ehnto wrote: post #64
lxgr wrote: post #14

It's absurd how unusable Cloudflare is making the web when using a browser or IP address they consider "suspicious". I've lately been drowning in captchas for the crime of using Firefox. All in the interest of "bot protection", of course.

I recently had the insane experience of filling out 15 consecutive captchas, after, I had checked out and entered my payment information into the payment processor widget. I just wanted to submit the order. I was logged in to their website, and the bank even needed a one time code for payment. If the bank is pretty sure I am human then your ecomm site can figure it out surely.

That's my favorite combination: Shitty bot detection meeting shitty payment security systems.

At least outside the US, there's 3DS as an (admittedly often high friction) high quality cardholder verification method, but in the US, that's of course considered much too consumer-hostile, so "select 87 overpasses" it is.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#129

Post by jaccola »

CorneredCoroner wrote: post #96

> A headless browser that loads the HTML but doesn't execute the JavaScript bundle won't have them. this is meaningless btw. A browser headless or not does execute javascript.

I disagree, a browser can have javascript execution disabled (and this is somewhat common in scraping to save time/resources).

I read it to mean: "A browser that doesn't execute the JavaScript bundle won't have [the rendered React elements]." Which is true.

Re: ChatGPT won't let you type until Cloudflare reads your React state

#130

Post by delish »

mzajc wrote: post #109
magicseth wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If apple approves it, ive got a solution: A keyboardthat attests to your humanity https://typed.by/magicseth/2451#2NyGLfAQxmqRiAOTlaX7ma3G4d1o...

Brilliant! Just the thing we want: more hardware attestation, more deanonymization, less user control, all diligently orchestrated in a repository where the only contributor is Anthropic Claude [0]. Comes complete with a misaligned ASCII diagram in the README to show how much effort the humans behind it put in! Yes, even their "humanifesto" is LLM output, and is written almost exclusively in the "it's not X it's Y" s…

Those are all situationally-valid criticisms, but I've long thought the ability to have smartphones' cameras cryptographically sign photos is good when available. The use case is demonstrating a photo wasn't doctored, and that it came from a device associated with e.g. a journalist, who maintains a public key. Of course, it should be optional.
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