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Astral to Join OpenAI

astral.sh

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781–790 of 951 posts

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#781

Post by LtWorf »

birdfood wrote: post #747
NiloCK wrote: post #67

A concern: More and more plainly, OpenAI and Anthropic are making plays to own (and lease) the "means of production" in software. OK - I'm a pretty happy renter right now. As they gobble up previously open software stacks, how viable is it that these stacks remain open? It seems perfectly sensible to me that these providers and their users alike have an interest in further centralizing the dev lifecycle - eg, if Clau…

These companies are telling us software development is over. They are positioning themselves as the means of production. You want to build anything you do it through them. And since ‘software is solved’ this is not a software but a user acquisition.

Why do they need to acquire users who are developers if software development is over?

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#782

Post by neves »

rob wrote: post #248
druml wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small tool shop, burning VC money, true. "Tiny part of the Python ecosystem" is an understatement given how much impact uv has made alone.

Just a tiny project with over 100 million downloads every month, over 4 million every day. No big deal. Just a small shop, don't overstate its importance. https://pypistats.org/packages/uv

Don't understate its importance. I've been using Python for more than 30 years. They solved a problem that a lot of smart people didn't solve (). Python developer experience improved an order of magnitude.

() Sure, they were on the shoulders of giants

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#783

Post by neves »

bmitc wrote: post #774
rtpg wrote: post #670

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Poetry and friends are so bad that many people continued just using pip -r requirements.txt despite knowing about this other stuff Poetry having users isn’t the metric for success. pip having way less users is.

How is uv awesome and Poetry so bad? They do basically the same things except Astral re-invents the wheel but only part way instead of just relying on the existing tools. uv is fast. As far as I can tell, there's hardly any difference in functionality except for it also replacing PyEnv, which I never use anyway.

uv has a lot of sensible defaults that prevent clueless developers to shoot their own feet. Uv sync, for example, would uninstall packages not in pyproject.toml

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#784

Post by pjmlp »

MangoCoffee wrote: post #737
pjmlp wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice idea in theory, in practice is how many folks down in Nebraska are going to show up.

isn't that's the point of open source software? like when Oracle bought Sun. someone forked mysql and created mariadb.

Indeed, and how much has it kept the pace versus the alternatives?

Also, the survivors are the exception, not the rule.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#785

Post by kpcyrd »

colesantiago wrote: post #301
kjksf wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't remember GitHub or Amazon advocating MIT over GPL. Feel free to prove me wrong by pointing out this massive amount of advocacy from "mega-clouds" that changed people's minds. The ads, the mailing list posts, social media comments. Anything at all you can trace to "mega-clouds" execs.

https://choosealicense.com/ https://choosealicense.com/about/ > "GitHub wants to help developers choose an open source license for their source code." This was built by GitHub Inc a very very long time ago.

I think this was more about "please choose _any_ license" because of the problem outlined here:

https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/1150/is-my-co...

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#786

Post by blazarquasar »

FreakLegion wrote: post #666
tomrod wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you could. I would stare longingly into the void, wondering if I can ever work another python project after having experienced uv, ruff, and ty. Such an outcome would make me wonder regarding the wisdom of "It is better to have love and lost than to have never loved at all."

Ruff is performant but finds about half the issues Pylint does (see https://github.com/astral-sh/ruff/issues/970 ). Ty is quantitatively the worst of the well-known type checkers (see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47398023 ). Uv is Astral's only winner.

You are aware that ty has only recently entered beta status?

Ruff isn’t stable yet either and has evolved into the de facto standard for new projects. It has more than double the amount of rules than Pylint does. Also downloaded more than 3 times as often as Pylint in the past month.

Pylint has some advantages, sure, but Ruffs adoption speaks for itself. Pylint is 25 years old. You’d hope they do some things better.

Saying that uv is their only winner is a hilarious take.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#787

Post by kpcyrd »

jhasse wrote: post #641
brabel wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean? MIT is essentially as open as you can get. The worst that can happen is that they will relicense, eventually, to force big users to pay, but when that happens everybody knows how it goes: some consortium of other big companies forks it and continues development as if nothing happened.

Well if it's GPL without CLA and they accept outside contributions, they can't relicense / make it propriatary. Unlike with MIT.

Step 1: discontinue the public repository, step 2: sell access to your GPL codebase.

The GPL (and even the AGPL) doesn't require you to make your modified source code publicly available (Debian explicitly considers licenses with this requirement non-free). The GPL only states you need to provide your customers with source code.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#789

Post by selcuka »

kpcyrd wrote: post #787
jhasse wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if it's GPL without CLA and they accept outside contributions, they can't relicense / make it propriatary. Unlike with MIT.

Step 1: discontinue the public repository, step 2: sell access to your GPL codebase. The GPL (and even the AGPL) doesn't require you to make your modified source code publicly available (Debian explicitly considers licenses with this requirement non-free). The GPL only states you need to provide your customers with source code.

Sure, but it also allows your customers to modify the source code you provided, and distribute/sell it. With MIT they can simply relicence it and sell binary-only versions. The open-ness stops at that point.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#790

Post by heavyset_go »

nunez wrote: post #593
Maxion wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If LLMs turn out to be such a force multiplier, the way to fight it is to ensure that there are open source LLMs.

Open-source models will never be _truly_ competitive as long as obtaining quality datasets and training on them remains prohibitively expensive. Plus, most users don't want to host their own models. Most users don't care that OpenAI, Anthropic and Google have a monopoly on LLMs. ChatGPT is a household name, and most of the big businesses are forcing Copilot and/or Claude onto their employees for "real work." This is…

Local models are more like browsers than servers. The user doesn't care where they're hosted, they click an icon and ask questions either way.
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