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Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

kagifeedback.org

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Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#101

Post by chrisandchris »

sph wrote: post #5

Good. I'm a paying user from day one, and I never used, nor want to see any AI features on my search engine. I'd use Google if I cared about any of that stuff. Honestly, I just want my money to be used to improve good old match-keywords-against-index search.

That's fine for me - as long as the new subscription (Pro+AI) is the same price as it is now.

If they increase the prices, well then my Kagi subscription is gone and I will move on. I'm a happy user for noe but I think search wuality has gotten worse lately and I'm more often using the AI instead of search because search just does not bring any good results anymore.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#102

Post by zipping1549 »

buster wrote: post #78
leokennis wrote: post #17

I admire and applaud Kagi for what they are trying to be. But on the AI front, the Assistant is simply worse than using for example Gemini or ChatGPT directly. It is slower, it cannot generate images etc.

Keep in mind that kagi offers a wide range of models, not just one. I wouldn't want to have multiple subscriptions (for chatgpt, anthropic, gemini etc.)

This is also true if you use something like OpenRouter, and it will almost always cheaper or betterter (excluding Kagi Search).

I love Kagi-I can't imagine going back to any other search engine-but it isn’t competitive when it comes to LLMs. In its defense, that’s largely because others are bleeding money.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#103

Post by arjie »

thi2 wrote: post #97
denkmoon wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why though. Why does it need to grow beyond a niche premium option? As long as they’re paying the bills and everyone is happy why not just let a good thing keep chugging along.

Investors want to see growth, chugging along is not the return they expect. It would be nice tho.

As far as I recall, the founder and angels have put in almost as much money as VCs. Certainly an interesting funding story.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#104

Post by [deleted] »

plutokras wrote: post #54
sph wrote: post #5

Good. I'm a paying user from day one, and I never used, nor want to see any AI features on my search engine. I'd use Google if I cared about any of that stuff. Honestly, I just want my money to be used to improve good old match-keywords-against-index search.

I’m also fine with the change. Claude is my go-to for research as the standalone app and shortcut are very convenient. The Kagi team should focus on the core product; that’s what I’m paying for. I stopped being a ProtonMail customer once they began chasing side projects instead of polishing their actual offering. I hope Kagi doesn't go down that same route.

[deleted]

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#105

Post by greatgib »

xigoi wrote: post #96
Affric wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am interested in this claim. Do you have a link?

https://kagifeedback.org/d/1338-provide-a-plan-without-ai-fu... > A common misconception is that AI is more expensive than search. Opposite is true - performing a search is 100x-1000x more expensive than doing an interaction with AI. > A single search is about ~ 1.5 cents (probably bit less these days, but general ballpark) > A small AI model can generate a lot of tokens for the same price > To put this in perspectiv…

Doesn't make sense because AI responses are not grounded, still for AI to make sense in this context, and have any relation with Kagi purpose, you need to have the search still, and then the AI process the search results.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#106

Post by xigoi »

greatgib wrote: post #105
xigoi wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://kagifeedback.org/d/1338-provide-a-plan-without-ai-fu... > A common misconception is that AI is more expensive than search. Opposite is true - performing a search is 100x-1000x more expensive than doing an interaction with AI. > A single search is about ~ 1.5 cents (probably bit less these days, but general ballpark) > A small AI model can generate a lot of tokens for the same price > To put this in perspectiv…

Doesn't make sense because AI responses are not grounded, still for AI to make sense in this context, and have any relation with Kagi purpose, you need to have the search still, and then the AI process the search results.

Common facts like “what is the capital of Hungary” are repeated so many times in the training data that the LLM knows them without a search.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#107

Post by denkmoon »

thi2 wrote: post #97
denkmoon wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why though. Why does it need to grow beyond a niche premium option? As long as they’re paying the bills and everyone is happy why not just let a good thing keep chugging along.

Investors want to see growth, chugging along is not the return they expect. It would be nice tho.

Sounds like a poisoned chalice.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#109

Post by mastermage »

112233 wrote: post #69
sph wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My comment sounds negative, but for what it's worth, I still am a very happy user, and you can disable assistant/quick answer so it's never pushed on you if you don't care about it. I just don't want Kagi to get enshittified. If everybody and their dog are focusing on AI, good-old search becomes a vanishing product space which definitely still has its place in the AI era, when you want determinism from your search.

So how much Kagi without AI costs? It should me much cheaper subscription, right?

hahahahaha as if.

Re: Kagi is contemplating the removal of the assistant from its professional tier

#110

Post by mastermage »

nchagnet wrote: post #77
DamnInteresting wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A user that does only traditional searches (not using Assistant) will cost more on our end than someone using AI + search. Unless I am missing something, that appears to be a mathematically impossible claim. They are saying A > A+B, where both A and B are positive values. I suppose it could be that non-AI users do more total searches, and the extras add up. Hmm.

They're likely saying that at equal usage, the user with mixed usage will cost less because the cost of B is lower than A.

how do you quantify equal usage?
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