Appears to be down, CoralCache link at http://www.nerdess.net.nyud.net/waffling/why-it-awesome-be-g...
Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
211–220 of 271 posts
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#212Appears to be down, CoralCache link at http://www.nerdess.net.nyud.net/waffling/why-it-awesome-be-g...
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think your theory hinges on the idea that most, if not all, of the players in this scenario are single. I work in a start-up environment with a bunch of men, but most of them are married or in a committed relationship. For what it's worth, I'm engaged. The whole "mysterious feminine influence" thing that you're talking about tends to disappear when people don't see you as a potential romantic/flirting partner. I th…
>I think your theory hinges on the idea that most, if not all, of the players in this scenario are single Not at all. In fact, he was quite clear that this has nothing to do with flirting or relationships in any way. It is simply that female approval is a huge factor in social status. Men instinctively view other men as more powerful, more competent, and respect them more if a women asks him a question instead of ask…
I apologize because I can't find the exact quote, but I believe Miss Manners said something to the effect of "Flirting, when done properly, means that both parties can claim they meant nothing by it." That's the flirting I speak of, the same sort of flirting/friendliness that was originally mentioned. It's foolish to assert that female approval matters, but darn it, no one knows why! It's just the way it is! In my experience, female approval matters because of the perception of sexual and romantic prowess that it grants to the receiver, especially in the eyes of other men. It's the idea of "Hey, she might sleep with that guy, under the right circumstances..." And that little sexual undercurrent is a huge part of your life when you're single.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
if modern UK life was a video game, "male" would be an easier difficulty level than "female". Can you explain this in concrete terms? This meme is repeated often, but few people actually explain what it means. Taking it literally, it would suggest that monsters receive +20% elemental resistance when women attack them with an ice-infused mace. But that's probably not what you mean. There are statistically less problem…
Can you explain this in concrete terms? Women still make 77 cents to the male dollar. Women have much higher incidences of anxiety and depression disorders. Women are substantially more likely to be the victims of domestic violence, and 1 in 5 are raped. Etc etc. These statistics don't guarantee that every woman is worse off than every man - clearly that's not true - but they do mean that women have, on average, more…
>Women still make 77 cents to the male dollar
False. Women get paid equally for the same work and the same hours. Averaging all women vs all men is dishonest. http://www.consad.com/content/reports/Gender%20Wage%20Gap%20...
>Women have much higher incidences of anxiety and depression disorder
Women have higher incidences of being diagnosed with depression. Men have much higher incidences of suicide. What does that tell you?
>Women are substantially more likely to be the victims of domestic violence
False. Repeated studies have indicated that domestic violence is equally likely to be perpetrated by men and women, and equally likely to happen to men and women: http://brainblogger.com/2008/06/08/woman-comparable-to-men-i...
>1 in 5 are raped
False. This statistic is often repeated (and varies from 1 in 3 to 1 in 6 depending on who is repeating it) but is based on deliberately misrepresenting the findings of studies on the subject. http://aspiringeconomist.com/index.php/2009/09/11/rape-stati...
>you know that men and women are treated differently in our society
And those differences manifest as both benefits and drawbacks, for both men and women. Characterizing that as "women have things harder" is absurd, and is only ever done by people deliberately picking and choosing the downsides and benefits they want to use to push their agenda.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I think your theory hinges on the idea that most, if not all, of the players in this scenario are single Not at all. In fact, he was quite clear that this has nothing to do with flirting or relationships in any way. It is simply that female approval is a huge factor in social status. Men instinctively view other men as more powerful, more competent, and respect them more if a women asks him a question instead of ask…
I apologize because I can't find the exact quote, but I believe Miss Manners said something to the effect of "Flirting, when done properly, means that both parties can claim they meant nothing by it." That's the flirting I speak of, the same sort of flirting/friendliness that was originally mentioned. It's foolish to assert that female approval matters, but darn it, no one knows why! It's just the way it is! In my ex…
>That's the flirting I speak of, the same sort of flirting/friendliness that was originally mentioned
I was responding to the idea that being single or not has some effect on the scenario. Flirting (whether deniable or not) is neither exclusive to single people, nor required to affect the social status of men you interact with.
>It's foolish to assert that female approval matters, but darn it, no one knows why!
It is foolish to assert that the universe exists, but darn it, no one knows why! We observe things, then we develop hypotheses to try to figure out why they are as they are. Then we test those hypotheses to see if they are accurate. The observation does not cease to exist simply because there are no hypotheses that have made it to proven theory.
>In my experience, female approval matters because of the perception of sexual and romantic prowess that it grants to the receiver, especially in the eyes of other men
That may well be the case at a subconscious level. But that doesn't go away because any or all of the people involved are in relationships. I have been married for over a decade. I do not actively seek the attention of women as a result of this fact, but I still treat them the same way, and they are still able to coerce me into doing what they want even though both of us are fully aware that there will be no sex rewards happening.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hang on, that's a little unfair. If you work in an office, and you know they have hired one person, and that is a cleaner / designer, walking unto the new face in the office and saying hi you must be the new cleaner / designer is not a prejudicial assumption. Especially if they are sitting in front of Blender / a mop.
No-one mentioned "seeing an eastern european with a mop". To expand on my analogy, if you met an eastern european/etc. at the company Christmas party, asking "so are you a cleaner?" is presuming negative stereotypes based on race/ethnicity.
Is it a negative stereotype that women are more likely to be designers than developers?
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Sounds like an alternate reality. I have a hunch that part of this is related to the fact that nerdess is German. Or at least, she's based in Germany per the site. I'm from Denmark (and a guy), and I can say from firsthand experience that attitudes towards women in Europe are still very old-school. Not everywhere, certainly, and Europeans are open-minded liberal socialists etc, but behind the scenes the old attitud…
Maybe you think of this campaign? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxsMWnK1X7k The tag line is "there is a lot of stuff women don't understand", and the format is a womans literal visualization of a sport metaphor. In this case, "giving away a goal". The campaign is still running, and considered one of the most successful advertising campaigns in Denmark. The company behind it is 80% state owned. and 20% owned by the n…
Yes, that was the one! I'm surprised it's still running.
> In our own self image, we are so liberal and open minded that we can safely joke about all kind of stereotypes.
So true - I'd say Danes are pretty blind to their own prejudices and backwards attitudes. I'm sure you remember "Perkerspillet" from some years ago?
"Perkerspillet", which roughly translates to "The Nigger Game", was an online flash game where the player was a stereotypical "gangsta" Turkish immigrant. You drove around the city in a souped-up BMW, trying to pick up Danish women and make money to further enhance your ride. They had to rename it to "The Mujaffa Game" after people stirred up controversy.
IMHO, I feel like the Danes often act like they're entitled to say whatever they want in the name of free speech, as if there'll be no consequences. That's why the Muhammad cartoon incident was such a wake-up call.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#218OK, nobody commented this up to now but I think is important: Among the many posts about this subject I've read on HN recently this was absolutely the best: Not only it approached the matter in a no-nonsense, practical matter without preaching from "the height of an unwritten book" or an axe to grind but it also gives excellent advice to young girls who want to venture into the field. With posts like this I wish ther…
So, basically, as long as women are willing to conform to stereotypes, you're all for women in tech. Gotcha.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. I'll look into it.
FWIW I have twice tried to get Venkatesh to read your blog: http://ribbonfarm.posterous.com/tech-companies-open-allocati...
I do... when specific posts cross my radar. Good stuff. No longer keep up deterministically with anything via RSS/email though.
Re: Why it is Awesome to be a Girl in Tech
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
> b: There's no "attractive male" advantage to be found in tech, at least not compared to "attractive female" advantage as your parent explained. Here's an excerpt from Vanity Fair's take on YC: Today, Jason Shen is a different speaker, one who exudes confidence. As he approaches the dais, the former collegiate gymnast does a cartwheel. “I thought you guys need a little pick-me-up or something,” he says, and goes int…
How does this compare to a "attractive female" advantage a girl has in an otherwise-100 % male startup for example? Of course, being fit, in a good shape both physically and mentally are - always - indisputable advantages over those who lack such qualities. However, this completely misses the point that an attractive female has such a tremendous control over the social structure within the company that it alone is so…
A lot of straight guys like to think that they would not be impressed by an attractive man. ☺
Maybe that's the reason?