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Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

businessinsider.com

31–40 of 57 posts

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#31
post #4

We went from “how can AI be useful to me” to “how can I be useful to AI”. Or headed that way.

Very nicely worded!

Everybody needs to think about how they can become the "human in the loop" in any AI based system. Whether we like it or not, all companies are looking to be AI primary and Human secondary with the only limiting factor being cost.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what a GCC is but I assure you that no one is opening offices in Israel.

I can assure you otherwise - hell two of my Israeli/American startups are about to come out of stealth in the coming days as RSAC is approaching. Even with the current Iran War and the Gaza War, it's been business as usual. Edit: can't reply > You may be putting your money there, but consumers aren't having it Most companies aren't B2C or B2B2C. Enterprise and B2B is solely outcome driven.

Look at the blowback on Vercel after the CEO went to Israel. You may be putting your money there, but consumers aren't having it.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#33
post #3

I'm surprised the article or the source for it didn't dive deeper into the impact the changes to H1B have had on the tech job numbers. Mind you I'm not trying to argue for or against them, but I find it hard to believe the changes aren't contributing at least a small amount to the drop. The other thing not mentioned is the impact on the end for ZIRP. Every tech company with a pulse over hired such a staggering amount…

> It's not surprising these companies are returning to reality and not hiring back to the same levels. The common claim from the "dont worry about AI stealing jobs" crowd is that there is nearly limitless demand for new software to be written. Even if over hiring is the reason for a lot of current job losses, the fact that over hiring is possible makes it obvious their Jevron's paradox claims are either lies or an at…

AI work creates surplus, we eat that away by specializing and becoming more dependent. Work doesn't stop, it becomes higher stakes, we depend on each other and AI now.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its impossible to ignore when a company laysoff thousands but then has thousands if verifiable H1Bs in the H1B logs. I agree with you. I'm not arguing for or against it. I do think leaving it out of the conversation is a willful choice and blaming job loss solely on AI is becoming propaganda at this point.

Employees on work visas are the first and easiest employees to lay off because we don't see our insurance premiums rise when laying them off (it's what most of us did early during COVID). And now with the $100K fees we have no incentive to hire most employees on a work visa anyhow. Hear that sound? It's the sound of GCCs opening in Poland, Romania, Israel, and India with those employees who were on work visas in the…

The matter of fact nature of your reply sounds highly, personally anecdotal. Given the confluence of moving parts from AI and policy/politics alone, let alone potential regional instability and the effects on US financial markets, it’s really impossible to speak to the next quarter, let alone year/years. Not saying your prediction is not correct, but few are.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#35
post #4

We went from “how can AI be useful to me” to “how can I be useful to AI”. Or headed that way.

Very nicely worded! Everybody needs to think about how they can become the "human in the loop" in any AI based system. Whether we like it or not, all companies are looking to be AI primary and Human secondary with the only limiting factor being cost.

I just agreed to my first terms of engagement with a company to do this very thing. There is strong demand for enabling SMB, especially tech adjacent businesses to do and know more for less. The job loses in the coming quarters will not be limited to technology.

Personally I think governments will force higher taxes on AI companies driving up the cost of tokens exponentially sooner than later. Paying a politician to pass favorable legislation becomes more difficult when their constituents are in food lines. Not impossible, but difficult. The best solution I think is good leadership. We don’t have that at the moment. That’s not just a “Trump thing,” though his open grift and dishonesty is really dangerous, we need leaders who can see and understand the moving parts and make decisions that benefit us all.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Employees on work visas are the first and easiest employees to lay off because we don't see our insurance premiums rise when laying them off (it's what most of us did early during COVID). And now with the $100K fees we have no incentive to hire most employees on a work visa anyhow. Hear that sound? It's the sound of GCCs opening in Poland, Romania, Israel, and India with those employees who were on work visas in the…

I don't know what a GCC is but I assure you that no one is opening offices in Israel.

Not right now, but there's a big tech scene in Tel Aviv and that won't go away for a while.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#37
post #2

Crazy that the job you hold in tech right now, might be the last tech job you ever hold. Cherish it.

I mean this with respect, but if this is your sincere worldview, I'd suggest you step outside the tech news bubble a bit more. There are some white collar jobs, possibly including many software engineers, that are at risk from gen AI. I guess there's some delicious irony in that, given that not long ago, we've been telling blue-collar workers to deal with economic shifts and learn to code. But short of some LessWrong…

I think the GP and many conflate tech jobs and relative high paying jobs. If you remove high paying from your filters you’ll get more results. Many have not accounted for that. Like most things, if you don’t own the means of production or income generation, your salary is just a loan. Once you’re out and can’t get back in and lose the things you’ve acquired it becomes more clear. The upside, we then start to treat one another better and can see more clearly how most were never actually in the club. After civil disruption comes better policy, historically.

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#38
post #17

It has been the dream of the wealthy to eliminate labor since at least the Industrial Revolution (and probably much longer). Workers are annoying. You have to pay them. They demand things like time off and safe working conditions. They hurt profits . Through the 20th century we saw increased automation that displaced so-caleld blue collar workers who were repeatedly told "get better skills" like this was somehow thei…

I agree on sensing some kind of systemic collapse. It feels those with more resources are getting increasingly efficient at extracting wealth from those with fewer resources.

I'm still trying to make sense of it.

Every tool increases efficiency at the expense of labor, but when it was the power loom and sewing machine the unemployed seamstresses and weavers couldn't afford to buy one.

This time everyone gets a power loom, though. So... what happens to the value of woven goods? And if we apply this to all modern knowledge work, what happens to the overall economy?

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#39
post #20
post #17

It has been the dream of the wealthy to eliminate labor since at least the Industrial Revolution (and probably much longer). Workers are annoying. You have to pay them. They demand things like time off and safe working conditions. They hurt profits . Through the 20th century we saw increased automation that displaced so-caleld blue collar workers who were repeatedly told "get better skills" like this was somehow thei…

> the tech people who told people to do computer science in college are now seeing automation come for their jobs. And now it's somehow an emergency worth addressing. You are in tech mostly forum, is it really that hard to grok why we discuss this more than other professions? Most folks out there are just happy with llms that they do a better search or help them do bureaucracy more efficiently and don't bother with i…

Therein lies the problem with hyper-individualism. It's not a virtue. It's just selfish. And short-sighted. It's the basis of First They Came [1].

It's even worse for tech people because tech fundamentally is about systems. Society is a system.

The reaons some of us care so much about how the least of us are affected by these changes is because the fabric of society depends on so many people and it hurts all of us when society falls apart. You don't have to be disabled to care about disabled rights, for example, because everybody is one incident away from being disabled. Just look at long Covid.

This isn't some Darwinian game where the "strong" "win". Or at least it doesn't have to be.

[1]: https://hmd.org.uk/resource/first-they-came-by-pastor-martin...

Re: Tech jobs are getting demolished in ways not seen since 2008

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its impossible to ignore when a company laysoff thousands but then has thousands if verifiable H1Bs in the H1B logs. I agree with you. I'm not arguing for or against it. I do think leaving it out of the conversation is a willful choice and blaming job loss solely on AI is becoming propaganda at this point.

Employees on work visas are the first and easiest employees to lay off because we don't see our insurance premiums rise when laying them off (it's what most of us did early during COVID). And now with the $100K fees we have no incentive to hire most employees on a work visa anyhow. Hear that sound? It's the sound of GCCs opening in Poland, Romania, Israel, and India with those employees who were on work visas in the…

Meta MLE hiring seems to still be going strong. They recently picked up a whole slew of people - all H1B - from one of the UCSD labs to work at HQ.
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