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Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

reuters.com

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Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#41

Post by AlexandrB »

bell-cot wrote: post #14
yesfitz wrote: post #10

Previous discussions: 3 months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45590900 4 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29977176 People have seemed critical of the presentation, scope, and goal of this program. (e.g. It's not "universal" basic income, the number of recipients is limited to 2,000, and why are artists being subsidized instead of essential workers?) Now it seems that we'll get some real worl…

> and why are artists being subsidized instead of essential workers? There are far more than 2,000 real, paying jobs for schoolteachers. And for grocery clerks. And for nurses. And for fire fighters. And for drivers of rubbish lorries. And for ... Not so much for the folks who hope to be the next James Joyce or Louis le Brocquy.

Many people who work as schoolteachers, grocery clerks, etc. at one point might have had ambition to be the next James Joyce.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#42

Post by dpc050505 »

its_magic wrote: post #28
TitaRusell wrote: post #15

They had something like this in the Netherlands during the 80s. Basically everyone was out of a job back then so it didn't really matter. Worst recession since 1929. Artists had to make a buch of art which was then given to the government. The state ended up with entire warehouses filled with crap.

[flagged]

Your mind will be blown once you discover rent seeking behaviour.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#43

Post by Legend2440 »

oulipo2 wrote: post #24
Legend2440 wrote: post #5

>pledging to pay 2,000 creative workers 325 euros ($387) per week >The randomly selected applicants will receive the payments for three years, after which they would not be eligible for the next three-year cycle. Is it really correct to call this UBI? It is hardly universal if it applies to only 2000 selected artists. Seems more like a 3-year grant, similar to the art grants awarded by the national endowment for the…

And? that's what "rolling out" is about, to test and gradually use the scheme if it works

The trouble is that paying a few people to not work is very very different from paying everyone to not work.

We need people to work to produce the things they need to live. As long as this remains true, UBI can never happen. This fantasy of being able to live without working is out of touch with the cold hard reality.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#44

Post by baseballdork »

its_magic wrote: post #34
oulipo2 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And? that's what "rolling out" is about, to test and gradually use the scheme if it works

[flagged]

This is such a bad faith argument. Society has largely agreed that welfare is a valuable thing to do, from disability to social security. Calling taxation theft just says that you aren't able to be rational about this.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#45

Post by arexxbifs »

Sweden introduced a similar scheme in 1964, in which artists (broadly defined, having since come to include one clown and one chess player) have been given a basic income, supplementing their other incomes up to a specific level.

Artists couldn't apply for this, but were officially selected. The program was stopped in 2010, meaning no new recipients have been selected since. As far as I know, there's been no studies surrounding any measurable increase in artistic quality or artistic output.

It is of course easy to point out how deeply unfair such programs are on multiple levels. Unsurprisingly, many recipients have utilized loopholes in order to receive the grant despite having incomes and wealth well above the threshold.

Edit to clarify: Sweden still grants long-term stipends to various artists, sometimes up to a decade. What's described above is a guaranteed, life-long, basic income.

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