Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native • Hacker News Board

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#281

Post by mark_l_watson » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:10 PM UTC

627467 wrote: post #113

ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #47

Can Europe build AI datacenters though? Europe has no wafer production and no companies that produce GPUs. That means it is dependent on Taiwan for wafers and the USA for GPU design. Then there is the question wether there is a will to invest. Gemini gives me this list of publicly traded companies in the US and what they invested in AI infrastructure in 2025: Amazon: $100B Alphabet: $90B Microsoft: $80B Meta: $70B Te…

People tend to fixate about cutting edge technology, but my naïve intuition says the problem in Europe is not in lack of some secret sauce: it is hidden in plain sight lack of energy to run the DC - and worse - lack of long term desire to make the tough choices to get that energy

I read years ago that Hetzner placed data centers near inexpensive power, but I understand that the EU’s energy situation has deteriorated. So you are correct, they have the larger energy problem to contend with.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#282

Post by 202508042147 » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:11 PM UTC

andsoitis wrote: post #263

202508042147 wrote: post #58

Last week I migrated our db away from AWS RDS to a European cloud provider. Everything runs fine and we also have it cheaper! One of our domains is due for renewal in a couple of months. I'm setting up the transfer to a EU registrar for it next week. This all takes time and it's not the most important thing for the bottom line, but on the long run I'm sure I'll look back and say it was a great investment.

> Last week I migrated our db away from AWS RDS to a European cloud provider. Everything runs fine and we also have it cheaper! If I may ask, why didn't you choose the cheaper option before? What do you think you're trading off, if anything?

Going with the default, we were already using other services from them.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#283

Post by fsflover » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:12 PM UTC

dumbfounder wrote: post #254

pjmlp wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone needs Web scale. As proven by Huawei, ingenuity can go a great way when friendships go sour.

So is your solution that Europe only creates small companies?

Some people do think so: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43156785

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#284

Post by swordbeta » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:14 PM UTC

varispeed wrote: post #256

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #169

I like it how everyone says that, but there is no european cloud operator able to offer what AWS/GCP/Azure offer. And if you are a start-up and you want to grow, the situation is even more dire. And without a few hundreds of billions of EUR invested _today_ there will still be at least a decade until basic infrastructure will be somewhat on par with current day hyperscalers from the US. And Office suite wise, it took…

online.net is quite close.

Why not just say Scaleway?

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#285

Post by drivingmenuts » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:14 PM UTC

Will they also need to separate from the banking systems? As I understand it, almost every banking transaction goes through a US-based network.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#286

Post by ExoticPearTree » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:14 PM UTC

Nextgrid wrote: post #257

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #169

I like it how everyone says that, but there is no european cloud operator able to offer what AWS/GCP/Azure offer. And if you are a start-up and you want to grow, the situation is even more dire. And without a few hundreds of billions of EUR invested _today_ there will still be at least a decade until basic infrastructure will be somewhat on par with current day hyperscalers from the US. And Office suite wise, it took…

> no european cloud operator able to offer what AWS/GCP/Azure offer I guess we must be living on different planets. I have recently deployed a Django application for a client of mine on Scaleway (due to an existing partnership we preferred using them over other infrastructure). Scaleway right now (you can signup and check it out) offers: * container registry - build an push your containers there * ECS/Fargate equival…

> What more do you need exactly? That's essentially all I would use from the incumbent cloud providers anyway.

Pub/Sub, Dataflow, CDN, GLB to name a few. I could go on with the list of services currently used by the people that pay to push buttons.

Not to sound offensive, but others have more than a Django app that they need to run.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#287

Post by 202508042147 » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:14 PM UTC

Imustaskforhelp wrote: post #159

202508042147 wrote: post #49

As a European, I am glad that this is finally discussed in the open! I have made multiple comments in the last weeks that one of the most important things, for me, is an alternative to the Visa/Mastercard duopoly. And yes, I can use an app to pay, but whenever I rent a car or purchase something online, I still use one of these two American companies. Why isn't the European Commission mandating these app payments in d…

We have UPI in India and it's pretty Robust. My brother actually was part of deal in talks to have UPI pilots as a project within London as a project within his college and I remember him talking about how UPI (India) is in talks with other European countries too. With the mother of all deals recently signed between EU and India. I sincerely hope that UPI can have access within EU markets too. If you ever come to Ind…

Yes, there are local alternatives like Pix here as well, but they only work in the same country. I need something that works across EU countries, like wero. I also need something that works on every site when I buy online and I can also use it when renting a car. So a real Visa/Mastercard alternative.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#288

Post by michaelt » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:15 PM UTC

nixpulvis wrote: post #249

kioku wrote: post #43

> This isn't just compliance theater; it's a straight‑up national economic security play. The woes of LLM contrasts… In all seriousness, the points made ring true not only for European companies and should make everyone consider the implications of the current situation, as dreary as they are.

Just as America would like to reduce its dependence on external production, so to do other countries want to reduce their own. We used to live in a world converging toward maximal international trade, when in fact it was exploiting underdeveloped nations. As we progress globally, and as the development gap shrinks, we have noticed power dynamics which weren't well guarded against in the old way. So now what? How do w…

> Just as America would like to reduce its dependence on external production, so to do other countries want to reduce their own.

If anything, I'd say for other countries it's more urgent.

If China embargoes deliveries of light bulbs to Europe, all the light bulbs already in place keep working. The pain would grow over time - giving a grace period, to ramp up local production.

If America embargoes AWS, Google, Apple and Microsoft? The pain would be instant and severe.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#289

Post by Nextgrid » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:16 PM UTC

Juliate wrote: post #271

mgh95 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Higher salaries aren't always better, especially when you're almost willfully ignoring more important things like purchasing power and quality of life. Senior SWE salaries I'm finding in a quick google search in Spain are 80k eur. According to levels.fyi [1] Google (and presumably the other clouds) are paying 170k eur. The comparison isn't even "is 4x the salary better in the US?" it's "is 2x the salary better in t…

But you still won't get with 170k in the Bay Area, what you get in Paris, Madrid, Nantes or Barcelona with 80k. In France, if you get 80k net, you do actually get ~160k, half of which is collected/distributed before by your employer to various mutualised funds (health, retirement, unemployment, state taxes, employee benefits, etc.). And the mechanism is somewhat similar in other EU countries.

80k net is 6.6k. If you're getting 80k (which is the very upper end of the range) it's likely you are in Paris, where you're gonna give at least 2k of that on rent for a shitty damp place, and double that for something decent.

Trust me I would love to quit consulting and be able to have a chill permanent job that can afford me a good flat and lifestyle. I'm still searching. Spain situation is very similar last time I ran the numbers.

Definitely no fucking way I'm helping anyone build a cloud provider (a cash cow considering the margins in there) for such pay. If I want to sell my soul to the devil, the one across the pond is gonna give me twice as many bucks for it.

Re: Euro firms must ditch Uncle Sam's clouds and go EU-native

#290

Post by 202508042147 » Sat, Jan 31, 2026, 2:17 PM UTC

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #169

I like it how everyone says that, but there is no european cloud operator able to offer what AWS/GCP/Azure offer. And if you are a start-up and you want to grow, the situation is even more dire. And without a few hundreds of billions of EUR invested _today_ there will still be at least a decade until basic infrastructure will be somewhat on par with current day hyperscalers from the US. And Office suite wise, it took…

> And if you are a start-up and you want to grow, the situation is even more dire.

I worked for/with several European startups. They really didn't need nor aim for planet scale operations.

There are also quite a lot of articles about how startups (in any country) focus needlesly on large scalability when they only really have a few customers. It's exactly the same false issue here.