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France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

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Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#251

Post by dyauspitr »

softwaredoug wrote: post #113

Americans fail to appreciate a few things about our economy 1. We have a large homgoneous market where you can build a product and it’s expected it can succeed for hundreds of millions of Americans 2. EU is the easiest second market, and another step change of hundreds of millions of customers in a somewhat unified market 3. there’s not an easy 3rd economy that replaces EUs wealth, population, and comfort with Englis…

We’re also pissing off Canada. This administration is actively destroying America to reduce the influence of American liberal values on the world. Destroying America is part of the plan.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#252

Post by SirMaster »

jorvi wrote: post #117
cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

The way out of this hole is by the EU mandating a 5, 10 and 20 year plan for getting off US tech and pivoting to open source. Start with a target small municipality in each country. Switch to SUSE (with a desktop that supports Active Directory), Collabora and what not. Then switch the mail stack. Then the files stack. Etc. Next step is scaling it up to a small city, then a big city, then a province, and finally the w…

Good luck getting the EU off Android and iOS?

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#253

Post by Imustaskforhelp »

brightball wrote: post #224
realo wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada is (was?) the single biggest commercial partner of the USA and Trump, in one of his tantrums, threatened to destroy that this week, with 100% tariffs. Canada is very much in the same boat as the EU.

Why did he threaten 100% tariffs?

I do feel as why demands reason and I am not sure if you can reason with the unreasonable which is what the Canadian speech was about in Davos and then POTUS threatened 100% tariffs again.

Kind of proved the point of America being an un-reliable partner which is what I inferred from Canadian PM's speech & his call for middle economies to connect with each other and strengthen together to have more leverage overall.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#254

Post by stackghost »

brightball wrote: post #224
realo wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada is (was?) the single biggest commercial partner of the USA and Trump, in one of his tantrums, threatened to destroy that this week, with 100% tariffs. Canada is very much in the same boat as the EU.

Why did he threaten 100% tariffs?

Because after the US threatened to destroy our economy and/or annex us by force and/or cancel nu-NAFTA and/or impose tariffs on us regardless, we realized that Americans don't actually want us as friends so we started diversifying our trade partnerships and negotiated a mutual tariff relaxation deal with China.

The previous Canada-US relationship is gone. Months ago I wrote on HN that purely by virtue of having to weather this storm, the nature of Canada-US relations will be irrevocably and fundamentally altered. Even if Trump and his cronies were jailed tomorrow, it's too late. The rest of the world understands that Trump is just a symptom of the disease affecting America and it's going to get worse, not better.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#255

Post by overfeed »

Zigurd wrote: post #231
softwaredoug wrote: post #113

Americans fail to appreciate a few things about our economy 1. We have a large homgoneous market where you can build a product and it’s expected it can succeed for hundreds of millions of Americans 2. EU is the easiest second market, and another step change of hundreds of millions of customers in a somewhat unified market 3. there’s not an easy 3rd economy that replaces EUs wealth, population, and comfort with Englis…

The typical mature technology company in the US earns half their revenue from outside the US. Makes it harder to understand even tacitly supporting white supremacy and ignorant isolationism.

A core tenet of the "dark enlightenment" mind-virus that has taken hold of the valley is the idea that civilizational decline/collapse is not only inevitable but imminent, so they don't really mind getting a bigger slice of a smaller cake, as long as they are in charge[1].

However, they also are getting citizenships from other countries or buying pacific island bunkers: just in case.

1. The collapse inevitabilitism absolves them of any guilt when their actions make the world worse, since "it was going to happen anyway"

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#256

Post by Manfred »

harikb wrote: post #94
cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

Products don't necessarily win on merit. Microsoft Teams "won" entirely because it was given away free with Office. Even though it is acceptable these days, it was horrible when it started. There is no way it could have won without unlimited backing from a bigger force. You have to see EU trying these things in the same light.

I have also seen situations where sales opted into Microsoft early on. When they grew in relation to engineering forced the rest of the company to standardize to Microsoft products so they could get better rates and “save money”.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#257

Post by swiftcoder »

cmiles8 wrote: post #230
swiftcoder wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “the sky is falling” rhetoric It's hardly rhetoric, from the European perspective. The EU is already embroiled in a proxy war against a major power in Ukraine, and are now faced with the prospect of their strongest erstwhile ally moving to annex EU territory. Simultaneous war on two fronts, where one opponent is deeply embedded in your supply chains, is an existential threat.

I’ll give you that the current US administration isn’t exactly scoring points for subtle diplomatic negotiation, but remember too that most of the United States was purchased from other countries. It’s not a completely bonkers idea that the US could purchase all or some of Greenland. In the end, we’ll probably just see a strengthening or enforcement of the existing treaty for US military use of Greenland which is all…

> Europe is still getting used to the president’s rather unique, and yes aggressive, negotiation style

I think you’ll find the EU doesn’t have much appetite for this sort of thing. They’ll take the risk at face-value, and put mitigations in place going forward (including if necessary, divestment from US tech firms)

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#258

Post by Epa095 »

SirMaster wrote: post #252
jorvi wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way out of this hole is by the EU mandating a 5, 10 and 20 year plan for getting off US tech and pivoting to open source. Start with a target small municipality in each country. Switch to SUSE (with a desktop that supports Active Directory), Collabora and what not. Then switch the mail stack. Then the files stack. Etc. Next step is scaling it up to a small city, then a big city, then a province, and finally the w…

Good luck getting the EU off Android and iOS?

It would take Samsung (or what's left of Nokia) a whole 10 seconds to produce a Google-free phone based on the Android Open Source Project (AOSP) if there was a market for it. Which it might soon be.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#259

Post by stackghost »

tormeh wrote: post #235
ddalex wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> build a better model with lower latency. That's mighty impossible for the european mindset - people here are not so risk-eager as to through hundreds of billions on infrastructure for something that might return a profit.

The US capital markets are truly a wonder to behold. There's no way to replace that. For good and ill, you'd only get weird looks in Europe if you asked for €10 billion for an unproven business model in what's somehow also a competitive market. To be fair this example does look a lot like insanity.

>There's no way to replace that.

Nothing is truly irreplaceable

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#260

Post by Am4TIfIsER0ppos »

Imustaskforhelp wrote: post #249
jshen wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not clear that anything will be kneecapped. You need more than a desire to not use these products, you also need a viable alternative. Using products from China or Russia probably isn't deemed viable if the concern is politics, which leads to a need for Europe or Canada to build alternatives. They have not been good at this for a long time, maybe that will change, but it's not clear that it will.

India. Today India invited President of EU commission on its republic day & I feel like there are discussions on signing free trade agreement. I was in my car watching it live when I recognized the President of EU commissioner and I was like hey!! I feel like friendly relations of EU and India are definitely on the rise & I have said this previously as well and talked to my other cousins/family who works in Coding an…

I can't wait to see how many indians we are going to be forced to import due to that "free trade deal". They must have looked at how well it went in canada and said among themselves "now that's how you destroy a country we gotta get some of that". [EDIT] Hopefully national politicians get balls, more balls, and tell their MEPs to vote against it like the mercosur deal.
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