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Yes, It's Fascism

theatlantic.com

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Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#161

Post by jLaForest »

smw wrote: post #150
dang wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN has had numerous major frontpage threads that are critical of this administration. Not enough to satisfy those who want more, but that is a separate issue.

Hey, I think you're a superhero for making this place such wonderful forum for deep and interesting conversation, but isn't there some point where you might consider putting your finger on the scale to help stop the slide into authoritarianism? This seems like the moment, maybe?

It's a matter of taking his finger off the scale... Stop taking down threads with productive discussion just because they conflict with your worldview (and financial interests)

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#162

Post by jLaForest »

mickle00 wrote: post #85
jLaForest wrote: post #76

[flagged]

fwiw it's been flagged and unflagged four times since I posted. I don't know the algorithm -- but it's been great to see whomever is unflagging understanding the importance and significance of this issue and relevance to hackers everywhere.

And here it remains flagged... I wonder why?

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#163

Post by tavavex »

Zigurd wrote: post #149
messe wrote: post #112

This should not have been flagged off the front page. I really worry for the people in the US, but I'm hopeful it's hegemony is ending.

Techno accelerationists don't like to be reminded of their complicity.

I don't think accelerationists would mind - even if they believe that what's happening is wrong, going further in is the backbone of the whole ideology, so why would they be having second thoughts?

I think the real group behind this is people who are capable of sensing that this is wrong at least on some deeper level, but who are so complacent that they just want not to think about it too much. Maybe it's because they're in too deep, maybe they make too much money off of it to care, maybe their heels are too dug in on social issues for them to ever try to reconsider. Possibly a combination of any of the three.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#164

Post by messe »

throwworhtthrow wrote: post #146
mickle00 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish there was more transparency around mod actions

The mods (dang and tomhow) have written probably 50,000 words on the subject. I've also emailed the mods and promptly received personal replies. Transparent as you could ever hope for: https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=dang

So the explanation for this removal condemning the ongoing fascist revolt in the US is where?

At least that's what it looks like to an outside observer from elsewhere in the world. It's been fascinating as an outsider to watch your republicans suddenly unsure about the second amendment after the last few days.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#165

Post by magicalhippo »

array_key_first wrote: post #93
quercus wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They literally voted for it.

They voted for something else, they were conned by populist messaging.

If you voted for Trump and is surprised by anything that's happened the past year, that's like trying to say you thought the 12 year old girl was actually over 18.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#166

Post by WickyNilliams »

wrs wrote: post #151
WickyNilliams wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same pattern played out in Germany. The centrists were more concerned with leftists than Hitler. Big business thought they could cosy up to him and keep him under control. Opportunistic collaboration for self preservation or personal benefit. Of course these all turned out to be grave miscalculations. I imagine that pattern will eventually play out this time too...

Is it possible their only miscalculation was not realizing how much of the world would fight back? Because if it hadn't, they would have continued enjoying the benefits.

No I don't think so. Broadly they hitched their cart to a genocidal madman. Their hubris convinced them they could maintain a steer on its direction.

The centrists ultimately lost when the Nazis banned other political parties. If they were not murdered first. And the Nazis took control of the German workforce, imposed harsh taxation on businesses, central planning, nationalization etc.

I'm sure the uneasy alliance worked well for a a little while though!

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#167

Post by tavavex »

tombert wrote: post #142
mickle00 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish there was more transparency around mod actions

I think generally the mods like to avoid anything involving "politics" since it's likely to start a flame war. The issue, of course, is that literally anything can be "political", and moreover by trying to actively avoid political discussions you sort of tacitly endorse the status quo. It's a tough line to draw, and I'd be lying if I said where I knew where to draw it; HN is a fun forum specifically because the moder…

It is a difficult issue. For the longest time, the status quo-favoring position of not complaining about anything divisive too much worked well because the status quo had been relatively unchanging - most people grew up with it so everyone took it for granted, and even most types of pushback was far more reserved than what we see today.

But now that the status quo of Western countries had begun rapidly shifting into something completely different, the other side of that initial ruling is starting to bear fruit. I really think that at this point they should revisit this policy - not to abandon moderation, but make amends that try to distance this place from the current political establishment. What was yesterday's implicit favoring of the boring consensus is now a defined position that's supportive of whatever the current powers do. But, being more cynical, given how close HN is to Y Combinator, I'm not sure if that option is on the table.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#168

Post by C6JEsQeQa5fCjE »

tombert wrote: post #17
fugalfervor wrote: post #5

I am so terribly disturbed by the ICE shootings (and killings). There is no justification for them. This is supposed to be a nation of laws and the rights of those shot (to say nothing of those abducted and harassed, beaten, or removed without due process) has been so grossly violated that it's hard to believe. My heart aches for the countless victims of this band of fascists in the executive branch.

The killings are horrifying in their own right, but the most disturbing part to me is how quickly the Trump administration will just declare these people as "terrorists" before any kind of investigation has happened. This suggests to me there is some level of systemic intent (or at least ambivalence) with this administration's use of ICE's use of lethal force. It is beyond concerning. This admin is now very literally…

> the most disturbing part to me is how quickly the Trump administration will just declare these people as "terrorists" before any kind of investigation has happened

Imperial boomerang. After enabling Israel/IDF which routinely just shoots unarmed people and officials on all levels simply justify it with "Terrorists.", and also routinely denies ambulance access to victims shots, it was only a matter of time until such and similar tactics come back home. Because politicians back home saw that the world was okay with it, so why not do it home.

People are supposed to defend their rights from far away, so that they don't have to defend them uncomfortably close when it's too late to avoid many casualties.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#169

Post by eudamoniac »

I read through every comment in this thread and no one seems to be addressing that the people voted for this. They'll probably vote for it again in the midterms and/or 2028. You're despairing over a democratic outcome. What do you actually propose that would fix this? Disenfranchise half the country? Outlaw things people are voting for to happen? Any criticism needs to address how we democratically counter this regime, how this makes sense when this is the voted upon regime, or perhaps make an argument for why democracy has failed.

My perspective is that a scale has tipped, a critical mass of people decided they want this sort of thing, and they got it. It wasn't rigged, it wasn't fraudulent, it was a democratic election. Critique democracy itself, or the criticism is incoherent. Make an argument for why a government should be disallowed from doing things that the voters want it to do.

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