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Yes, It's Fascism

theatlantic.com

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Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#141

Post by Jordan-117 »

renewiltord wrote: post #41

It's true. This kind of authoritarian state violence is pretty reminiscent of fascism. Especially what looks like a gangland execution of a man who could only ever be described as exercising his 2A rights by carrying a firearm undrawn legally under his CCW. However, the list of things that have been called fascism are so long that I have to admit that my eyes initially glazed over the headline because many things hav…

A careful reader will notice that both of those warnings are about the same person. The same person who tried to illegally and violently overturn that 2020 election result. Maybe they weren't crying wolf after all?

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#142

Post by tombert »

mickle00 wrote: post #129
messe wrote: post #112

This should not have been flagged off the front page. I really worry for the people in the US, but I'm hopeful it's hegemony is ending.

I really wish there was more transparency around mod actions

I think generally the mods like to avoid anything involving "politics" since it's likely to start a flame war.

The issue, of course, is that literally anything can be "political", and moreover by trying to actively avoid political discussions you sort of tacitly endorse the status quo.

It's a tough line to draw, and I'd be lying if I said where I knew where to draw it; HN is a fun forum specifically because the moderation is generally very good. They're not perfect but they do try and shut things down before they devolve into flame wars and personal insults. If there weren't aggressive modding, HN would devolve into 4chan or 8chan, and it wouldn't be appealing to me after the age of ~17.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#143

Post by tombert »

RealityVoid wrote: post #15
fugalfervor wrote: post #5

I am so terribly disturbed by the ICE shootings (and killings). There is no justification for them. This is supposed to be a nation of laws and the rights of those shot (to say nothing of those abducted and harassed, beaten, or removed without due process) has been so grossly violated that it's hard to believe. My heart aches for the countless victims of this band of fascists in the executive branch.

> I am so terribly disturbed by the ICE shootings (and killings). There is no justification for them. I think they are simply poorly trained people that are given free reign. The results are disastrous. They probably don't wake up thinking "Today I'm going to murder someone" but they just don't realize what they're doing. I'm not sure how it's at the destructiveness scale at this moment, but these organizations can a…

> They probably don't wake up thinking "Today I'm going to murder someone" but they just don't realize what they're doing.

Maybe not explicitly, but I do think there's a selection bias towards people who do want to do that. If you know you can get away with exerting violence towards a group of people you don't like, then that career is going to be very appealing towards people who want to do that.

It's the same thing with priests and their abuse of children. It's not like being a priest turns you into a child-abuser. It's just that priests are in a situation that they're constantly surrounded by kids unsupervised, can live alone unmarried without anyone questioning it, and when they do something horrible and abuse their power then they're often just moved to another parish. Of course a job like that is going to be attractive to people who want to abuse children.

I think ICE is similar. I do think there are people who join ICE with genuinely noble intentions, like getting rid of cartels and whatnot, but the Trump admin has made ICE something extremely appealing to people who have worse intentions.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#145

Post by UncleMeat »

convolvatron wrote: post #62
renewiltord wrote: post #41

It's true. This kind of authoritarian state violence is pretty reminiscent of fascism. Especially what looks like a gangland execution of a man who could only ever be described as exercising his 2A rights by carrying a firearm undrawn legally under his CCW. However, the list of things that have been called fascism are so long that I have to admit that my eyes initially glazed over the headline because many things hav…

you're saying that because as recently as 10 years ago, some people were warning about fascism taking hold in the United States, and even though they turned out to be right, they should have held off using that word until we reached this moment, where no sensible person would argue.

And it isn't even like it was different people. Donald Trump has been the protagonist of the GOP for ten years. The people who were saying "this is creeping fascism" were saying it about the same guy who is doing it now.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#146

Post by throwworhtthrow »

mickle00 wrote: post #129
messe wrote: post #112

This should not have been flagged off the front page. I really worry for the people in the US, but I'm hopeful it's hegemony is ending.

I really wish there was more transparency around mod actions

The mods (dang and tomhow) have written probably 50,000 words on the subject. I've also emailed the mods and promptly received personal replies.

Transparent as you could ever hope for: https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=dang

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#147

Post by WickyNilliams »

touwer wrote: post #83

The most scaring and amazing thing is not Trump himself, but all the people (suddenly) supporting him and being silent (including too many Democrats) in order to keep their position or for for opportunistic purposes. And destroying democracy along the way. Just like all the secret police agents in Iran or the henchmen of Hitler. CEO's of bigtech. Crypto-libertarians. Too many people are sucking up to wannabe dictator…

Same pattern played out in Germany. The centrists were more concerned with leftists than Hitler. Big business thought they could cosy up to him and keep him under control. Opportunistic collaboration for self preservation or personal benefit.

Of course these all turned out to be grave miscalculations. I imagine that pattern will eventually play out this time too...

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#148

Post by messe »

tombert wrote: post #142
mickle00 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish there was more transparency around mod actions

I think generally the mods like to avoid anything involving "politics" since it's likely to start a flame war. The issue, of course, is that literally anything can be "political", and moreover by trying to actively avoid political discussions you sort of tacitly endorse the status quo. It's a tough line to draw, and I'd be lying if I said where I knew where to draw it; HN is a fun forum specifically because the moder…

The limit should be outright fascism. It's not a tough line to draw if you've any inkling of 20th century history. The USA isn't sleepwalking, it's goose-stepping into a fucking nightmare.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#149

Post by Zigurd »

messe wrote: post #112

This should not have been flagged off the front page. I really worry for the people in the US, but I'm hopeful it's hegemony is ending.

Techno accelerationists don't like to be reminded of their complicity.

Re: Yes, It's Fascism

#150

Post by smw »

dang wrote: post #113
jLaForest wrote: post #76

[flagged]

HN has had numerous major frontpage threads that are critical of this administration. Not enough to satisfy those who want more, but that is a separate issue.

Hey, I think you're a superhero for making this place such wonderful forum for deep and interesting conversation, but isn't there some point where you might consider putting your finger on the scale to help stop the slide into authoritarianism? This seems like the moment, maybe?
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