Add a defunct cryptotoken?
Hey, Telegram had one. He had to get to feature parity.
Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
101–110 of 180 posts
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#102what did he do for messaging? Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp. in fact, given that Whatsapp had not been heavily shilled as the "totally private messenger for journalists and whistleblowers :^)" by the establishment media, I distrust it less. edit @ -4 points: please go ahead and explain why does Signal need your phone number and reject third party clients.
Even if you discount Signal he did more or less design the protocol that WhatsApp is using https://techcrunch.com/2014/11/18/end-to-end-for-everyone/
Also while we would expect heavy promotion for a trapped app from some agency it's also a very reasonable situation for a protocol/app that actually was secure.
You can of course never be sure but the fact that it's heavily promoted/used by people on both the whistleblowers, large corporations and multiple different National Officials at the same time is probably the best trustworthyness signal we can ever get for something like this.
(if all of these can trust it somewhaat it has to be a ridiculously deep conspiracy to not have leaked at least to some national security agency and forbidden to use(
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#103Do what he did for messaging? Make a thing almost nobody uses?
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#104Do what he did for messaging? Make a thing almost nobody uses?
If this is how little you think of an app with ~50 million monthly active users, I take it making apps with a billion MAU is something you routinely do during your toilet breaks, or...?
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#105The website is: https://confer.to/ "Confer - Truly private AI. Your space to think." "Your Data Remains Yours, Never trained on. Never sold. Never shared. Nobody can access it but you." "Continue With Google" Make of that what you will.
My issue is it claims to be end-to-end encrypted, which is really weird. Sure, TLS between you and your bank's server is end-to-end encrypted. But that puts your trust on the service provider.
Usually in a context where a cypherpunk deploys E2EE it means only the intended parties have access to plaintexts. And when it's you having chat with a server it's like cloud backups, the data must be encrypted by the time it leaves your device, and decrypted only once it has reached your device again. For remote computing, that would require LLM handles ciphertexts only, basically, fully homomorphic encryption (FHE). If it's that, then sure, shut up and take my money, but AFAIK the science of FHE isn't nearly there yet.
So the only alternative I can see here is SGX where client verifies what the server is doing with the data. That probably works against surveillance capitalism, hostile takeover etc., but it is also US NOBUS backdoor. Intel is a PRISM partner after all, and who knows if national security requests allow compelling SGX keys. USG did go after Lavabit RSA keys after all.
So I'd really want to see this either explained, or conveyed in the product's threat model documentation, and see that threat model offered on the front page of the project. Security is about knowing the limits of the privacy design so that the user can make an informed decision.
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#106what did he do for messaging? Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp. in fact, given that Whatsapp had not been heavily shilled as the "totally private messenger for journalists and whistleblowers :^)" by the establishment media, I distrust it less. edit @ -4 points: please go ahead and explain why does Signal need your phone number and reject third party clients.
> Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp.
To be fair, that is largely because WhatsApp partnered with Open Whisper to bring the Signal protocol into Whatsapp. So effectively, you're saying "Signal-the-app is hardly more private than another app that shares Signal-the-protocol".
In practical terms, the only way for Signal to be significantly more private than WhatsApp is if WhatsApp were deliberately breaking privacy through some alternative channel (e.g. exfiltrating messages through a separate connection to Meta).
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#107what did he do for messaging? Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp. in fact, given that Whatsapp had not been heavily shilled as the "totally private messenger for journalists and whistleblowers :^)" by the establishment media, I distrust it less. edit @ -4 points: please go ahead and explain why does Signal need your phone number and reject third party clients.
> Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp
Kind of because Whatsapp adopted Signal's E2EE... And not even that long ago!
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#108what did he do for messaging? Signal is hardly more private than goddamn Whatsapp. in fact, given that Whatsapp had not been heavily shilled as the "totally private messenger for journalists and whistleblowers :^)" by the establishment media, I distrust it less. edit @ -4 points: please go ahead and explain why does Signal need your phone number and reject third party clients.
Yeah, it seems kind of funny how Signal is marketed as a somewhat paranoid solution, but most people run it on an iPhone out of the app store with no way to verify the source. All it takes is one villain to infiltrate one of a few offices and Signal falls apart. Same goes for Whatsapp, but the marketing is different there.
Ok so which iPhone app can be verified from source?
Or is your problem that your peer might run the app on an insecure device? How would you exclude decade old Android devices with unpatched holes? I don't want to argue nirvana fallacy here but what is the solution you'd like to propose?
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure why you're gettimg downvoted. This is exactly what he did to instant messaging; extremely damaging to everyone and without solid arguments for such design.
Or, he took a barely niché messaging app plugin (OTR), improved it to provide forward secrecy for non-round trips, and deployed the current state-of-the art end-to-end encryption to over 3,000,000,000 users, as Signal isn't the only tool to use double-ratchet E2EE. >broken SGX metadata protections Citation needed. Also, SGX is just there to try to verify what the server is doing, including that the server isn't colle…
> You can download the app as an .apk from their website if you don't trust Google Play Store.
I wish apple & google provided a way to verify that an app was actually compiled from some specific git SHA. Right now applications can claim they're opensource, and claim that you can read the source code yourself. But there's no way to check that the authors haven't added any extra nasties into the code before building and submitting the APK / ios application bundle.
It would be pretty easy to do. Just have a build process at apple / google which you can point to a git repo, and let them build the application. Or - even easier - just have a way to see the application's signature in the app store. Then opensource app developers could compile their APK / ios app using github actions. And 3rd parties could check the SHA matches the app binaries in the store.
Re: Confer – End to end encrypted AI chat
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure why you're gettimg downvoted. This is exactly what he did to instant messaging; extremely damaging to everyone and without solid arguments for such design.
Or, he took a barely niché messaging app plugin (OTR), improved it to provide forward secrecy for non-round trips, and deployed the current state-of-the art end-to-end encryption to over 3,000,000,000 users, as Signal isn't the only tool to use double-ratchet E2EE. >broken SGX metadata protections Citation needed. Also, SGX is just there to try to verify what the server is doing, including that the server isn't colle…
>over 3,000,000,000 users
Is that a typo or are you really implying half the human population use Signal?
Edit: I misread, you are counting almost every messaging app user.