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Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

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Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#171

Post by balops »

diego_moita wrote: post #164
gruez wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. What makes this more valid than something like "it's incredible how many YIMBY talking points there are" in a thread about housing, aside from you agreeing with the…

> Is "talking points" just a roundabout way to summarily dismiss the opposition's arguments and imply they're dumb/misguided? For me, yes it is. It wouldn't if policy discussions were purely technical and well informed. In the arena of public discourse they aren't. The majority of the population (including HN) is tribal, ideologically biased, emotionally driven and badly informed. Public discourse, particularly in Am…

[flagged]

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#172

Post by jacquesm »

siscia wrote: post #114
noosphr wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even the people who understand the scale don't understand the purpose. The Chinese grid isn't renewable or non-renewable. It's built to keep the lights on for anything short of a thousand year catastrophe. Their 2060 plan has enough non intermittent base load that they can run the whole country off it for a decade. That half of your grid capacity is there 'just in case' is something no one in the west can wrap their…

What's the hard part?

Climate change, and having an abundance of energy allows a country to offset some of those challenges.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#173

Post by balops »

account42 wrote: post #117
zipy124 wrote: post #74

It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. That is not to say that these projects should be free of criticism, but anyone who believes these negatives are remotely close to the damage that fossil fuels are doi…

It's incredibly how common it is these days to see valid criticism dismissed as "X talking points" or "Y dog whistle". I guess that's easier than providing an argument.

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Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#174

Post by nomadpenguin »

btbuildem wrote: post #163
CuriouslyC wrote: post #137

One neat thing is that solar/wind farms can be multi-use. You can position panels to provide shade and wind-break to provide micro-climates for plants and animals.

The fact that parking lots in the south of US aren't just covered in those makes no sense at all. Vast expanses of mostly empty pavement, bathed in sun all day? Shaded parking? No?

The Cincinnati Zoo covered all their parking lots with solar panels last year. Your car stays cool in the summer, and there's motion activated lighting under the panels after dark. It's awesome.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#175

Post by tim333 »

dzonga wrote: post #80
roxolotl wrote: post #21

It genuinely makes me so sad to see the US not doing the same. Having grown up to the constant beat of “energy independence” as the core goal of a party it seemed obvious that the nearly limitless energy that rains down from the sky would be the answer. But instead we’ve kept choosing the option which requires devastating our, and other’s around the world, community. That’s not to exclude the harsh reality of mining…

it seems us is fighting yesterday's war wars / empires etc are built on mastering an energy source the Brits on Coal the US rose on Oil China is rising on renewables my worry is can renewables be quickly brought online to power industry / power hungry Data Centers etc at a reasonable cost

China did most of its rising on fossil fuels. I think they are fairly pragmatic as to what to use.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#176

Post by lolc »

raducu wrote: post #136
delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And since renewable + batteries is now cheaper than nuclear, we should spend our money and time wisely. Eggs in one basket. Renewables are good, but it gets cloudy, it becomes night, it might not be windy. Nuclear will output power come rain or shine, and like I said, it's not like China isn't investing in advanced fission. They're throwing money at everything to see what sticks. They're working on SMRs, molten sal…

> Eggs in one basket. Renewables are good, but it gets cloudy, night is a thing, it might not be windy Also, we can't survive an asteroid crash/extinction event with solar. Nuclear is transcedental. If we had practically unlimited fusion power, we could build underground, grow plants in aquaponics and aeroponics and ride it out in underground cities and farms.

Fusion will be its own extinction event as things go. At our development level, if we develop fusion, we'll have to live underground after boiling the oceans to generate crypto tokens and undress videos.

The asteroid is just science unlikely fiction.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#177

Post by hackeraccount »

zipy124 wrote: post #74

It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. That is not to say that these projects should be free of criticism, but anyone who believes these negatives are remotely close to the damage that fossil fuels are doi…

Really? I don't think I have a dog in this hunt but my judgement of comments is that it's maybe 70/30 (with the 30 being critical in one way or the other) and anyone critical is getting down voted to oblivion.

That said "you're just repeating what you're told" is a comforting argument but doesn't go all that far.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#178

Post by stuaxo »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #103
spiderfarmer wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU is moving towards 50% sustainable with lots of countries that at 60-75%, while the USA is at 25%. Europe is also at least a decade ahead. And since renewable + batteries is now cheaper than nuclear, we should spend our money and time wisely.

> And since renewable + batteries is now cheaper than nuclear, we should spend our money and time wisely. Eggs in one basket. Renewables are good, but it gets cloudy, it becomes night, it might not be windy. Nuclear will output power come rain or shine, and like I said, it's not like China isn't investing in advanced fission. They're throwing money at everything to see what sticks. They're working on SMRs, molten sal…

> Eggs in one basket. Renewables are good, but it gets cloudy, it becomes night, it might not be windy.

That's two baskets right there.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#179

Post by tim333 »

CalRobert wrote: post #110
c-flow wrote: post #3

Meanwhile, in London, UK, local council doesn't allow you to put anything on your rooftop that doesn't gel with the Victorian look..

For more amusement, look to Limerick, in Ireland, whose council tried to mandate all new homes have chimney stacks.

In Ireland all the rooms came with a substantial hole in the wall, mandated in case you decided to put something like a kerosene heater in your room, although the heating was electical. I generally had to block them off to stop the wind whistling through.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#180

Post by HumblyTossed »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #87
zipy124 wrote: post #74

It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. That is not to say that these projects should be free of criticism, but anyone who believes these negatives are remotely close to the damage that fossil fuels are doi…

I was just about to make precisely the same comment. The fear, uncertainty, and doubt about renewables here is ridiculous, and I expected better. I suppose everyone watched too much Landman . China is rocketing ahead in every domain possible, from resource and financial independence, to infrastructure in terms of high-speed rail, bridges, roads, advanced fission reactors and bleeding-edge fusion research. Heavy indus…

> I suppose everyone watched too much Landman.

No, too much Fox "News".

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