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Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

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Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#141

Post by Rover222 »

appointment wrote: post #41
roxolotl wrote: post #21

It genuinely makes me so sad to see the US not doing the same. Having grown up to the constant beat of “energy independence” as the core goal of a party it seemed obvious that the nearly limitless energy that rains down from the sky would be the answer. But instead we’ve kept choosing the option which requires devastating our, and other’s around the world, community. That’s not to exclude the harsh reality of mining…

> That’s not to exclude the harsh reality of mining for the minerals required to build these, nor the land use concerns. This is Big Oil propaganda. The impact from this is massively less than the horrific damage caused by every part of the fossil fuel industry.

Similar to the idea that electric cars are net worse for the environment because some of the materials used to make them. Worse than 20 years of burning gasoline in an ICE car? It's so ridiculous.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#142

Post by noosphr »

siscia wrote: post #114
noosphr wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even the people who understand the scale don't understand the purpose. The Chinese grid isn't renewable or non-renewable. It's built to keep the lights on for anything short of a thousand year catastrophe. Their 2060 plan has enough non intermittent base load that they can run the whole country off it for a decade. That half of your grid capacity is there 'just in case' is something no one in the west can wrap their…

What's the hard part?

Nuclear build out, wires and transformers.

China has been building 5% extra nuclear capacity every year for the last 30 years. On target for making up 24% of their energy mix in 2060.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#143

Post by MandieD »

madeofpalk wrote: post #52
roxolotl wrote: post #21

It genuinely makes me so sad to see the US not doing the same. Having grown up to the constant beat of “energy independence” as the core goal of a party it seemed obvious that the nearly limitless energy that rains down from the sky would be the answer. But instead we’ve kept choosing the option which requires devastating our, and other’s around the world, community. That’s not to exclude the harsh reality of mining…

Its crazy that in 1999 "home solar" was a fancy, new millennium idea, and now we're still barely any closer. Honestly, I think building regulations should mandate solar energy for homes.

Seeing fewer rooftop solar installations when I visit my home state (Texas) than I see in the one I live in (Bavaria) is a trip. Yes, I know that electricity is far cheaper there than here, but as much electricity as air conditioning eats, and as big as those roofs are (panels are cheap; it's the system that's expensive), it should balance out.

Anecdotally, a ton of solar has gone up in the last four years here in Germany, both rooftop and, increasingly, in what were likely canola fields for biodiesel along highways - at first driven by Russia's invasion of Ukraine and the need to reduce natural gas consumption, but now by how absolutely cheap those panels are. Too bad they're not being made here...

My favorite installation so far: a large field in SW Germany, with the panels high enough for cattle to wander and grass to grow under them. The cattle were almost all under those panels, munching away - it was a hot day.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#144

Post by hnmullany »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #103
spiderfarmer wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU is moving towards 50% sustainable with lots of countries that at 60-75%, while the USA is at 25%. Europe is also at least a decade ahead. And since renewable + batteries is now cheaper than nuclear, we should spend our money and time wisely.

> And since renewable + batteries is now cheaper than nuclear, we should spend our money and time wisely. Eggs in one basket. Renewables are good, but it gets cloudy, it becomes night, it might not be windy. Nuclear will output power come rain or shine, and like I said, it's not like China isn't investing in advanced fission. They're throwing money at everything to see what sticks. They're working on SMRs, molten sal…

It's two orders of magnitude difference between renewables and nuclear though. China commissioned about 3GW of nuclear and almost 300GW of solar last year.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#145

Post by JensKnipper »

avsteele wrote: post #106
JensKnipper wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By showing only your provided data it seems. But when looking at the share of primary energy consumption from renewable sources it looks totally different! https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/energy?tab=line&facet=n...

That metric doesn't answer the same question. It isn't saying 18% of their needs are being met by renewables.

If you look at the growth rate of renewables it should be pretty clear that coal will not play a major role in the foreseeable future. Why is it not saying 18% of the needs are being met by renewables? That's exactly what it does

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#146

Post by hnmullany »

ben_w wrote: post #130
raincole wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> no one talks about it People regularly talk about how much new coal capacity China has been building. Quite often this is followed by "capacity, sure; they're not using all that capacity, those plants exist and are mostly not running", or some variation thereof. I've never bothered fact-checking the responses, but this conversation happens is most of the Chinese renewables discussions I've seen in the last few year…

Coal generation production in China did decline in 2025 vs 2024 - but that was the first year for it to happen.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#147

Post by samiv »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #87
zipy124 wrote: post #74

It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. That is not to say that these projects should be free of criticism, but anyone who believes these negatives are remotely close to the damage that fossil fuels are doi…

I was just about to make precisely the same comment. The fear, uncertainty, and doubt about renewables here is ridiculous, and I expected better. I suppose everyone watched too much Landman . China is rocketing ahead in every domain possible, from resource and financial independence, to infrastructure in terms of high-speed rail, bridges, roads, advanced fission reactors and bleeding-edge fusion research. Heavy indus…

With China's huge resources both natural and human it's only expected that China will again reclaim its position as the leading country in science, technology, production and generally everything.

If you assume that .5% of population are "einsteins" then China has 7.5m einsteins who are now able to access universities and advance sciences whether it's AI or solar power or self driving cars.

There's no doubt about the fact that the future belongs to China.

There's just no way to deny this. The economical and political power will shift to China.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#148

Post by gruez »

zipy124 wrote: post #74

It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread. That is not to say that these projects should be free of criticism, but anyone who believes these negatives are remotely close to the damage that fossil fuels are doi…

>It is incredible to see just how many big-oil talking points there are in this thread. From renewable energies resource costs, to their land use impact. I didn't realise just how effective their propaganda was in the tech space till reading this thread.

What makes this more valid than something like "it's incredible how many YIMBY talking points there are" in a thread about housing, aside from you agreeing with the YIMBYs? Is "talking points" just a roundabout way to summarily dismiss the opposition's arguments and imply they're dumb/misguided?

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#149

Post by hnmullany »

pbasista wrote: post #23
margorczynski wrote: post #7

Wouldn't it be better to just go with nuclear? Isn't this a gigantic waste of space and overhead to maintain it? And how "renewable" are the materials used to produce these?

> how "renewable" are the materials used to produce these Very renewable. Solar panels are mostly glass, silicon and a little bit of metal. And they last ~30 years. Wind turbine blades are made out of fiberglass or similar materials. They may need replacing every ~30 years as well. Other infrastructure would not need any significant maintenance for even longer. These kind of power plants, apart from being renewable,…

Mono-crystalline silicon - which is now the dominant technology - is a pretty clean, but thin film PV - which is on the wane - had high heavy metal content. Good news.

Re: Photos capture the breathtaking scale of China's wind and solar buildout

#150

Post by hnmullany »

throwaway7679 wrote: post #16
margorczynski wrote: post #7

Wouldn't it be better to just go with nuclear? Isn't this a gigantic waste of space and overhead to maintain it? And how "renewable" are the materials used to produce these?

This construction of wind and solar has nothing to do with renewable, and everything to do with China's desire to get as much electricity generation as possible, which involves increasing nuclear, coal, hydro, and everything else.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China

That wikipedia article needs to be updated for the last few years.

2025 was the first year where coal generation declined YoY. Nuclear capacity additions in 2025 were about 1% of solar additions - there is no comparison. Primarily solar and secondarily wind is the core generation strategy.

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