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Linux is good now

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Re: Linux is good now

#681

Post by gloomyday »

fxtentacle wrote: post #598
PaulKeeble wrote: post #2

I think its interesting that mainstream PC gaming press is now talking about Linux. We have the benchmark Youtube channels doing some benchmarks of it as well and plenty of reports of "it just works", which is pretty promising at least for the games that aren't intentionally excluded by DRM. For me its still controllers and equipment incompatibility due to my VR headset and sim wheel/pedals setup, I use Linux everywh…

The Quest 3 works offline with ALVR streaming over a private (non-Internet connected) WiFi network. Together with my 3090 I get 8k @ 120fps with 20ms latency over a WiFi6e dongle. I had to manually install the dkms for the dongle on PopOs, but apart from that it just works. ALVR starts SteamVR and then I use Steam to start the game. Proton seems to use Vulcan for rendering.

Overall, I had a pretty bad experience with ALVR. I never managed to figure out the cause of stuttering on mine. I wished Meta would support Linux.

Re: Linux is good now

#682

Post by everdrive »

kaoD wrote: post #624
sylens wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's really the paradigm shift - communities were self-organizing and self-moderating before. Now game publishers want to control all aspects of the online experience so they can sell you content and skins, so that means matchmaking and it means they have to shoulder the moderation burden.

> communities were self-organizing and self-moderating before This led to legit players that were just good being banned by salty mods, or cheaters that were subtle enough to only gain a slight edge not being banned.

And now, you have false anticheat bans. If you get banned from a server you can just join another server. (or even start your own!) If you get falsely banned from the game by anti cheat your money was in some sense stolen.

Re: Linux is good now

#683

Post by versteegen »

foepys wrote: post #657
Cort3z wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been working professionally on Linux for many years. But about once a year I have to reinstall the os because it craps out for various reasons. The same story goes for most of my team, but for some reason they seem ok with this. My issue with Linux is this: I don’t feel like a consumer, but a janitor. I don’t want this. Yes you can do whatever you want, but I don’t want to do those things. I want to write code…

I don't know what you are doing but I have my Arch Linux running since about 2013. I needed to intervene a few times, I think 4 times in total but the base installation in from 2013, now nearly 13 years ago.

That's pretty good, I'm jealous! The last time I reinstalled my OS (Slackware) from scratch was 2009, but I run into serious problems every couple of years when upgrading it to 'Slackware64-current' pre-release, because Slackware's package manager doesn't track dependencies and you can just install stuff in the wrong order: I usually don't upgrade the whole OS at once... just have to fix any .so link errors (I've got a script to pull old libraries from btrfs snapshots). I've even ended up without a working libc more than once! When you can't run any program it sure is useful that you can upgrade everything aside from the kernel without rebooting!

Re: Linux is good now

#684

Post by beAbU »

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #606
chmod775 wrote: post #524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some would consider not being able to play that game a feature!

You might be saying it in jest, but I think there may be something to this line of thinking. Whenever I read about anything on HN and bazzite comes up, it feels like the beginning of a new holy war is approaching. I am starting to wonder if the concern from the 'older' linux crowd is that the gamers will introduce changes to linux that will corrupt it more than systemd ever could ( like kernel level drm in games ).

Nobody is forcing anyone to play video games. Kernel level anti cheat DRM is inevitable if linux becomes remotely mainstream in the esports scene.

Those that don't like it can simply not play the games, or can have a dedicated "compromised" machine/vm for gaming.

Re: Linux is good now

#685

Post by GuB-42 »

MegaDeKay wrote: post #288
fooker wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last remaining roadblock is kernel level anti-cheat frameworks. Pretty horrible technology, and unfortunately a good majority of the gaming industry by revenue relies on it.

I'd say there are two remaining roadblocks. First and biggest is kernel level anti-cheat frameworks as you point out. But there's also no open source HDMI 2.1 implementation allowed by the HDMI cartel so people like me with an AMD card max out at 4K60 even for open source games like Visual Pinball (unless you count an adapter with hacked firmware between the card and the display). NVidia and Intel get away with it be…

This is kind of a niche problem. It only affects people with AMD GPUs running games at over 4k60 with HDMI. Get an NVidia or stay at 60 FPS or stay at 1080p or use DisplayPort and you will be fine.

It is not really a roadblock, more like a bump, and it is not the only bump by far. Some games just don't run on Linux, or quite terribly and they don't have a big enough community for people to care. Sometimes one of your pieces of hardware, maybe an exotic controller, doesn't like linux. Sometimes it is not the fault of the game at all, but you want to do something else with that PC and it isn't supported on Linux, and you don't want to dual boot. Overall, you will have less problems with gaming on Windows, especially if you don't really enjoy a trip to stackoverflow and the command line, but except for anti-cheat maybe, there is no "big" reasons, just a lot of small ones.

And sure, it is improving.

Re: Linux is good now

#686

Post by cogman10 »

ahartmetz wrote: post #638
kentonv wrote: post #242

I switched all the machines at https://lanparty.house over to Linux a couple months ago. So far, we've experienced noticeably fewer problems on Linux compared to Windows. Stability and performance are better. I can't think of one game we tried that didn't work. And wow is it nice not to have all the ads and crapware in our faces anymore. (I'm aware that Battlefield series and League of Legends won't work due to draco…

It keeps surprising me how many people don't care about some of the most popular games today. I mean I don't care about Battlefield or League of Legends neither, but in earlier decades of PC gaming, almost everyone had some of the most popular games. Doom, Half-Life (1 + 2) and such. The games market today seems more similar to music in its fragmentation.

It's not surprising to me.

The reason some of the most popular games are popular isn't because they are fun, it's because they've built an esports industry. Those popular games get spectators which in turn makes the games more popular.

Re: Linux is good now

#687

Post by tuetuopay »

user34283 wrote: post #676
tuetuopay wrote: post #625

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK this comes down a lot to NVIDIA not doing enough efforts for the Linux drivers. There is a pretty well documented and understood reason for the perf hit NVIDIA GPUs get on Linux. Honestly, considering where we came from, a 10-30% perf drop is good and is a reasonable tradeoff to consider. Especially for all the people that don't want to touch Windows 11 with a 11-foot pole (which I am), it's a more than decent…

To each their own, but Windows 11 runs flawlessly on my machine with high-end specs and a 240 Hz monitor. The Start menu works great with no lag, even immediately after booting. The only thing that I consider annoying would be the 'Setup' screens that sometimes show up after bigger updates. --- Would I trade it all to get on Bazzite DX: - lower game compatibility and potential bugs - subpar NVIDIA drivers with the ri…

Considering I found the win10 start menu too slow, the w11 one does not stand a chance. But I'm hopeful from your comment, it shows that w11 is not the complete shitshow people make it to be, though the few times I used it on relatives computers I found it not responsive enough.

I'm testing daily-drive on my main rig (high-end from a few years ago, 5900x + 3090), and honestly I'm rediscovering my computer. A combination of less fluff, less animations, better fs performance (NTFS on NVMe is suboptimal), etc. I was getting fed up by a few windows quirks: weird updates breaking stuff, weird audio issues (e.g. the audio subsystem getting ~10s latency for any interaction like playing a new media file or opening the output switcher), weird display issues (computer locking up when powering on/off my 4k tv), and whatnot. I'm still keeping the w10 install around, as having an unsupported OS is less of a problem for the occasional game, especially since I mostly play offline games.

As for the dev env, you're not limited to bazzite, I run Arch. Well, I've been running it for two weeks on the rig. But you really get the best devex with linux.

Re: Linux is good now

#688

Post by cindyllm »

digiown wrote: post #364
__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be less antianticheat if I could just select the handcuffs at boot time for the rare occasion where I need them. Although even then I'd still have qualms about paying for the creation of something that might pave the path for hardware vendors to work with authoritarian governments to restrict users to approved kernel builds. The potential harms are just not in the same league as whatever problems it might solve f…

Once a slave, always a slave. Running an explicitly anti-user proprietary kernel module that does god-knows-what is not something I'd ever be willing to do, games be damned. It might just inject exploits into all of your binaries and you'd be none the wiser. Since it wouldn't work on VMs you'd have to use a dedicated physical machine for it. Seems to high of a price to play just a few games.

[dead]

Re: Linux is good now

#689

Post by Tom1380 »

mrheosuper wrote: post #502
fooker wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last remaining roadblock is kernel level anti-cheat frameworks. Pretty horrible technology, and unfortunately a good majority of the gaming industry by revenue relies on it.

I am wondering can game be shipped with their own "kernel" and "hypervisor", basically an entire VM. Yes performance will take a hit, but in my experience with my own VM, it's like 15-20%.

Do you pass through the GPU? Or how does it work?

Re: Linux is good now

#690

Post by ahartmetz »

gloomyday wrote: post #678
ahartmetz wrote: post #638

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It keeps surprising me how many people don't care about some of the most popular games today. I mean I don't care about Battlefield or League of Legends neither, but in earlier decades of PC gaming, almost everyone had some of the most popular games. Doom, Half-Life (1 + 2) and such. The games market today seems more similar to music in its fragmentation.

There are simply too many games, and many genres are underserved by AAA studios.

Strange things are happening regarding genres served by AAA studios. Some of them come and go fairly quickly. There was a brief resurgence of strategy(!!) games because of XCOM.
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