Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

electrek.co

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

271–280 of 836 posts

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#271

Post by neuroelectron »

FuriouslyAdrift wrote: post #79
neuroelectron wrote: post #11

I actually did want a lighter, 2 Wheel Drive Cybertruck (for $40,000). The "Long Range" trim was close. But it was actually $70k not the $60k they were saying. Get rid of the touchscreen and the four-wheel-drive steering and the electrical flush door handles, the hatch thing in the back, smaller wheels, any other electronic features like 120v inverters, etc. solid rear axel would be nice but that would be a major red…

You should look at the Slate... https://www.slate.auto/en

Not falling for that again, I'll consider it when it actually exists

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#272

Post by ggreer »

iknowstuff wrote: post #215
fencepost wrote: post #88

Doing a quick bit of searching based on the 4680 makes me think that there has been or will be a change from NMC811 to LFP chemistry in the 4680, including one article talking about changing to US and European-based in-house manufacturing and reducing dependence on China. I'm no fan of Tesla, but this looks like the collapse of the contract with the supplier for the battery chemistry they've moved away from, aka "no…

This makes sense but does it make sense to manufacture LFPs as 4680 cylinders instead of rectangular blocks/blades, given https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYD_Blade_battery ?

Which cell technology to use depends on the application. Tesla actually uses BYD blade batteries in some of their vehicles sold in Europe. The main issue with prismatic cells is that to be safe, they must be made with LFP chemistry, which hurts energy density. LFP is also worse at charging/discharging when cold, though battery management software mostly solves that.

Cylindrical cells make sense for higher performance NMC and NCA chemistries, as they can be cooled more easily (coolant lines can run in the voids between cylindrical cells), and any single cell failure is less likely to cascade to other cells. Batteries with cylindrical cells were easier to repair, but nowadays cells are welded together instead of bolted, so that's no longer an advantage.

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#273

Post by Tycho »

nemomarx wrote: post #2

Tesla stock dipped a little today it seems but it's still up 8 percent over the month. I really don't understand those investors and how they price a struggling company so highly.

Think of Tesla as a well-funded pharmaceutical company that has invented a cure for a widespread ailment (call it “driving”) and now is waiting on regulatory approval.

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#274

Post by mikestew »

qoez wrote: post #203
mr_mitm wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an entire Wikipedia article about Musk's (mostly) failed predictions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_predictions_for_autono...

The best counter argument to that is that he did manage to predict/make into reality electric vehicles (when going into that industry was crazy) and reusable rockets. If someone makes a thousand moonshot attempts but still succeeds with two that's impressive.

he did manage to predict/make into reality electric vehicles (when going into that industry was crazy)

Nissan might like a word about that.

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#275

Post by rchaud »

1121redblackgo wrote: post #140
mr_mitm wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an entire Wikipedia article about Musk's (mostly) failed predictions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_predictions_for_autono...

At what point is it fair to call the list something other than ‘predictions’

"Tech Optimism"

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#276

Post by rchaud »

silisili wrote: post #208
mr_mitm wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an entire Wikipedia article about Musk's (mostly) failed predictions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_predictions_for_autono...

I had no idea this existed, that's pretty damning. The question - is Musk lying on purpose, or is this more 90-90 rule where he made (obviously wrong) assumptions based on current progress?

How about the possibility that the cost of lying is less than the capital gains that can be realized by lying about it? EM was only fined $20 million when he said he had secured funding to take the company private at $420/share [0]. The stock bounce from that "news" was in the billions.

As it stands, he can get a trillion dollar pay package if a something-trillion market cap target is hit.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2024/04/elon-musk-loses-...

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#277

Post by Yoric »

alfiedotwtf wrote: post #175
Yoric wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Every report and available evidence shows he is barely technologically astute, nevermind genius; the accomplishments of his teams are despite him not because of him. In particular, nothing that comes out of his mouth regarding AI makes any sense. And still, people listen to him as if he was an expert. Go figure.

I just don’t get it? Do people hang off his every word just because he’s rich? What are they expecting for this worship… it’s not like he’s going to start throwing $100 bills to people because they agree with him on Twitter

Seen from the other side of the Atlantic, I've regularly felt that the US is rather prone to hero worship, see e.g. the passion dedicated to presidential candidates, former presidents, billionaires, but also how the main characters of pretty much all American biopics I recall can't ever be wrong.

If my observation is correct, I guess what we're witnessing with Musk could be a case of hero worship – and in any narrative in which Musk is a hero, he's of course right.

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#278

Post by wayeq »

Veserv wrote: post #9

A headline that actually undersells the article. The 2,900,000,000 $ deal to 7,400 $ is not just a 99% reduction, it is actually over a 99.999% reduction. I guess that is one way to get the "march of nines" they keep promising.

we humans aren't really good after the first couple 9's

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#279

Post by vel0city »

hvb2 wrote: post #243
oakesm9 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much every electric car has charging stops built-in to the navigation. For some the quality of the data isn’t as high, but it will be there. Many like Polestars and Renaults are built on Android Automotive (different from Android Auto) and the built-in navigation is full Google Maps with direct access to the cars battery state and control systems. Works perfectly on my Renault Megane E-Tech.

> Pretty much every electric car has charging stops built-in to the navigation That's my expectation too. > For some the quality of the data isn’t as high, but it will be there. This is a real issue. You might be stranded with low quality suggestions. Chargers that don't work. The large number of accounts you need to have as every charger has their own etcetera

In my non-Telsa, I get decent suggestions with live data built in to the car. I also get suggestions through multiple different apps of my choice through Android Auto.

In a Tesla, you get what Tesla gives you.

I haven't bothered with any accounts in years for third-party chargers. Most just plug in and negotiate payment automatically. Others have credit card readers on them. I haven't personally encountered out of service chargers on my road trips in a few years.

I can charge at most of the major Tesla charging locations as well these days. Ironically, those require I hop on a proprietary app with another account to manage, so I often avoid them.

Re: Tesla’s 4680 battery supply chain collapses as partner writes down deal by 99%

#280

Post by netsharc »

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #172
jqpabc123 wrote: post #5

For years, we’ve been told that the 4680 cell was the “holy grail” that would allow Tesla to produce a $25,000 electric car. For years, we've been told a lot of things that have never come to fruition. Just 6 months ago, we were told that Robotaxi would be available to half the US population by the end of the year. https://electrek.co/2025/07/23/elon-musk-with-straight-face-...

It's incredible there is something wrong with a group of people completely unable to see when someone is lying to them. And no matter how many times they are lied to, as long as they are rich enough they believe them. I don't know what to think anymore about this. He has continuously conned his way along and does it just long enough to jump to the next con. Tesla is crashing and somehow people though giving him a hug…

Only simpletons can't see the end game of beautiful profits!

https://americanliterature.com/author/hans-christian-anderse...

I always thought the story ended with the emperor and his entourage being embarassed after the child said he's naked... but no, it ends even more close to real human behavior. (Sorry for writing a clickbait sentence).

Post reply on HN