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Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

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Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#181

Post by m463 »

card_zero wrote: post #63

So, about one mushroom species in five is poisonous. Why is the ratio so low, why are there lots of edible ones? Without hard-shelled seeds to spread, why be eaten? And the poisonous ones apparently don't use color as a warning signal, and don't smell all that bad, and some of the poisons have really mild effects, like "gives only some people diarrhea" or "makes a hangover worse". Meanwhile three of the deadliest spe…

I think of those "genetic algorithm car thing" simulations that run in a browser.

weird stuff survives.

and good stuff crashes and burns sometimes.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#182

Post by boxed »

Sam6late wrote: post #153
estimator7292 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really fucking suspicious that mushrooms evolved mechanisms to produce serotonin. But it helps when you remember that a mushroom is the fruit of a (usually) much larger organism. Then you can start applying normal fruit rules. Some want to be eaten, or picked up and moved around. Some want to keep insects from infesting the fruit. Others don't give a damn and release spores into the wind or water. Also remember…

BTW, Caffeine is also a naturally occurring insecticide, yet humans tend to repurpose and hack things.

All spices basically too afaik.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#183

Post by mjanx123 »

estimator7292 wrote: post #142
card_zero wrote: post #63

So, about one mushroom species in five is poisonous. Why is the ratio so low, why are there lots of edible ones? Without hard-shelled seeds to spread, why be eaten? And the poisonous ones apparently don't use color as a warning signal, and don't smell all that bad, and some of the poisons have really mild effects, like "gives only some people diarrhea" or "makes a hangover worse". Meanwhile three of the deadliest spe…

It's really fucking suspicious that mushrooms evolved mechanisms to produce serotonin. But it helps when you remember that a mushroom is the fruit of a (usually) much larger organism. Then you can start applying normal fruit rules. Some want to be eaten, or picked up and moved around. Some want to keep insects from infesting the fruit. Others don't give a damn and release spores into the wind or water. Also remember…

The brain is a fiber network like the mycelium, likely the same genes (animals are related to mushrooms) and neurotransmitters are involved in its function.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#186

Post by attila-lendvai »

optimalsolver wrote: post #23
candiddevmike wrote: post #3

SWIM would like to know how to get paid as (instead of paying to be) "an expert who explores new mushrooms".

Exploring new mushrooms is more likely to end in agonizing death than piercing the veil of reality.

no, statistucally not.

but yeah, a warning is warranted.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#187

Post by card_zero »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #131
fc417fc802 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're being overly literal. It's not "trying to fit anthropomorphized design onto a process" but rather "using anthropomorphization as a descriptive tool". This situation is not unlike when someone takes issue with an analogy due to erroneously interpreting it as a direct comparison. > here are frequently multiple different "solutions" for a given metric So too are there multiple different options when working towar…

and you are missing my point that trying to help people understand a process that has no design element as if it was one that did actually does them (and the process) a disservice, possibly a great disservice.

I've told people off for using the pathetic fallacy too, in the past, I guess I just said "what do mushrooms want" for the sake of rhetoric. Well, because it would be funny. Fine then, I was trolling.

Thanks to your discussion though, I'm now wondering how to square the idea that evolution produces knowledge with the idea that it doesn't optimize even for reproductive fitness. I think you're technically incorrect there: it's that it doesn't optimize exclusively in the short term or by any one obvious strategy. The bottom line is that what survives survives, though, you can't argue with a tautology. Even if what survives is a sloth or a sleeper shark or a bristlecone or (imagine) a single infertile but incredibly tough organism, it still had to find a way (alright, stumble into a way). Maybe your objection is just that "optimize for" implies intent, but intentless-purism in language for biologists is as hard as pastless-purism in language for time travellers.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#188

Post by pandemic_region »

fooqux wrote: post #69
card_zero wrote: post #63

So, about one mushroom species in five is poisonous. Why is the ratio so low, why are there lots of edible ones? Without hard-shelled seeds to spread, why be eaten? And the poisonous ones apparently don't use color as a warning signal, and don't smell all that bad, and some of the poisons have really mild effects, like "gives only some people diarrhea" or "makes a hangover worse". Meanwhile three of the deadliest spe…

Two things: 0) Humans (and even our recent ancestors) eating you are a very recent thing to be concerned about, numbers-wise. By the time our numbers were enough to provide evolutionary pressure, we started farming what we wanted, which kinda breaks the process. Also. most poisons don't effect everything equally, so what might prevent a horse from eating you might taste delicious to us (like the nightshade family) or…

> $insane_argument_against_evolution

That looks like Perl variable syntax. Arguably the most mushroom like programming language.

Re: Experts explore new mushroom which causes fairytale-like hallucinations

#190

Post by HaukeHi »

card_zero wrote: post #63

So, about one mushroom species in five is poisonous. Why is the ratio so low, why are there lots of edible ones? Without hard-shelled seeds to spread, why be eaten? And the poisonous ones apparently don't use color as a warning signal, and don't smell all that bad, and some of the poisons have really mild effects, like "gives only some people diarrhea" or "makes a hangover worse". Meanwhile three of the deadliest spe…

Plants want to be eaten only by big animals that take them on long and random walks and then die far away from where they are picked up to fertilize the seed.
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