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Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

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Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#751

Post by dpark »

stackghost wrote: post #727
ascorbic wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An minivan will transport almost anything a normal person would want to move, while being more practical the other 99% of the time, but of course they have the wrong image.

Where I live (Vancouver Island) there's been somewhat of a Renaissance of the minivan-as-adventure-vehicle. Lots of imported Delicas but also a fair few of those Mercedes Sprinter 4x4s.

I wish my minivan was 2 inches higher and all wheel drive. I’m not sure how much I’d want to adventure in my front wheel drive low clearance van.

It’s a great vehicle for most practical cases, though it is not very fuel efficient.

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#752

Post by WorldMaker »

hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #633

Let’s assume that this is the correct decision in terms of the viability of the electric F-150 (I have no reason to believe Ford is wrong here). The real problem with this decision is that the F-150 is pretty much Ford’s only foray into EVs. It raises the question of how Ford expects to compete in the EV market, which is a bigger concern given that the world market is showing a clear preference for EVs, especially on…

Yeah, per the article Ford seems to have indeed decided that the current state of US politics mean that it can keep kicking the can down on the road on EVs, rebadge Renault's EVs as Ford to not entirely give up on Europe (but, uh, very much giving up on Europe manufacturing in everything but brand name still seems like giving up to me).

Ford presumably isn't going to also give up on the Mach-E, at least not it is not mentioned in this announcement, but yeah this signals a lack of confidence in America competing with the EV market.

(Ford's recent breakup with SK On, splitting custody on plants, presumably dropping the volume of batteries they are capable of producing, presumably is an influencing factor as well on giving up on the electric F-150.)

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#753

Post by tracker1 »

vel0city wrote: post #425
eucyclos wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw (and rode in) a lot of them in Alberta (Canada's Texas). Typical day for a work truck: -owner starts you up from the hotel parking lot -3-5 guys get in, you get your morning coffee via a drive through -You pick up a 'slip tank' of diesel (think a metal box with its own fuel pump that sits in the bed and holds about a ton of liquid when full). You might fill up your own tank at the same time, typically on the em…

Yes this is why every other driveway in the zero lot lines of DFW need 1-2 pickup trucks. Totally. This is way more extreme of usage than 99.99% of trucks made will ever see.

I'd generally rather see a crew cab pickup on the road than an oversized SUV with a single, tiny person driving solo. There is a lot more utility to a pickup, and the SUV doesn't particularly do much better on fuel economy.

That said, my SO has a large SUV, mostly in that I have trouble getting in and out of a low car now, and I'm no longer able to drive myself. My daughter has a smaller SUV/Truck (Hyundai Santa Cruz) with a smaller bed, that suits her needs nicely.

For that matter, there are plenty of people here that would do well if they could import the Japanese sized smaller trucks, which have a lot of import restrictions.

That said, I wouldn't want to drive such a thing offroad, up and over hills etc. regularly. I know a lot of Jeep/Pickup drivers that tow heavier things than you can with a car and go offroad to places you can't get to in a light vehicle regularly. Being functional for workloads as well is another benefit even if it isn't your job. That doesn't cover tradesmen who need the utility regularly and includes those who live in an apartment and can't otherwise just keep a large trailer parked at a random spot.

And yeah, it might be a status symbol... so is a typical super car, large suv or things like a Range Rover. There's nothing wrong with it, if someone wants to have it and anyone who has a problem with that can fuck right off.

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#754

Post by xnx »

tekno45 wrote: post #320
inasio wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My electrician drives an electric F-150, it's impressive how useful it is for him. The frunk carries a big box of tools, there's tons of outlets to charge his power tool batteries, he can even run a small welder

The F-150 is a great power bank that comes with a very useful set of 4 tires and a steering wheel for a truly portable charging experience.

131,000,000 mWh

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#755

Post by WorldMaker »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #652

But they didn't kill it? Everyone is missing the other side of the coin. It will still exist as a battery electric vehicle with the addition of a generator. You can still plug it in and drive just on battery pack power from the grid.

From my experience (driving one for more than a decade) an EREV is a step back at this point, and a worst of both worlds. Focusing on EREV models isn't going to keep Ford relevant in competition to Tesla and Rivian, much less most of what is going on in Europe and Asia today.

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#756

Post by fragmede »

ActorNightly wrote: post #748
exabrial wrote: post #43

I expected the "T word" to come out in the article, however this fails to address any of the practical reasons it isn't a good replacement for the value-engineered F-150: * The price isn't right for small businesses. These trucks are quite expensive * They're difficult to repair. A regular F-150 is designed to be repaired; these things are designed like iPhones to be disposable. * Parts availability is scarce, contra…

>They're loaded with useless/barely-functional interior electronics that are poor copies of Tesla Man, Tesla apologists are rewriting reality now. In no way shape or form is Tesla interior even remotely good.

I think you've been smelling too many of your car's ICE fumes there, mate. It's true that Tesla interiors aren't lined with old growth redwood trees that can never be replaced, and the seats don't use the finest baby seal leather like you'd find in a custom Bentley, but "even remotely good" is as ridiculous level of Elon hate as Teslafanboyism that thinks Elon Musk is the second coming (he's not). It's a car. The interior is fine. We can quibble if it's high end Honda-level fine or Benz level luxury, but it's not like the seats have an arm that stabs in you the chest at every stop light or something.

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#757

Post by tracker1 »

sroerick wrote: post #319
harpiaharpyja wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm one of those people. What is a work truck used for?

Other replies here have covered 'work truck' better than anything I'd come up with but I'll also add that some of the reasons people purchase trucks is: - To be able to help your friends move. - To be able to purchase supplies and move big things over long distances. - If you raise horses, you have to have a truck to pull your trailer. - If you own a tow behind or fifth wheel, you have to have a truck to pull it. - I…

I did about $3200 in damage to my (at the time) Challenger just going up an unpaved mountainside driveway... I definitely wouldn't take such a thing seriously offroad.

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#758

Post by dpark »

mrguyorama wrote: post #731
Amezarak wrote: post #599

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This logic is only ever applied to trucks. The majority of HNers did not make an economically rational decision when they bought their Macbook or iPhone. Consumers buy what they like and feel like they need and can afford. They place an almost absurdly high value on convenience and not having to think about things like "oh I need to move this thing I need to go rent a truck because I only ever need to do this once ev…

I have a long history of sneering at people who ceaselessly buy Apple products despite their lack of economic "efficiency" but I "have a finely calibrated sense of value" ie I'm a tightwad. Being "economically efficient" with laptop purchases saves you a few hundred to a thousand dollars. Being just reasonable with a car purchase saves you $25k. These are not at all comparable to the average american. The average new…

> Americans want to put down $50k for 80 months for a MANLY man truck for MANLY MAN things

Most people buying F-150s are spending way more than $50k.

But the hate big trucks get isn’t because they are expensive. I don’t care if someone spends 25, 50, or 100 thousand on their vehicle and I doubt most others do either. Trucks get hate because they are more dangerous to everyone else. A collision with a truck is 2.5x more likely to kill the driver of a car than a collision with another car. [1]

But the attacks on the “manliness” and ridiculous cost of modern trucks are more emotionally satisfying than discussions about their safety profile.

[1] https://www.axios.com/ford-pickup-trucks-history

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#759

Post by ActorNightly »

ericd wrote: post #430
jandrewrogers wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The limited range and inability to refuel quickly and easily in the middle of nowhere remains a critical deficiency for EV trucks in many parts of the US. Range is something you have to be conscious of even with ICE trucks in some areas even though they have better and more reliable range. There are places where I'd start thinking about fuel once I hit half a tank. Getting caught out in the middle of nowhere with a d…

Seems like EV trucks need the ability to do the equivalent of siphoning gas, or carrying some Jerry cans.

Or you know, PUT A FUCKING GAS GENERATOR IN A GIANT BED THAT YOU HAVE OUT BACK.

Im legit suprised this isn't a thing yet. I saw the Rivian gear tunnel when it got first announced, and I was almost sure that they are gonna offer a generator+fuel tank to fit into there for range extension.

You can do an efficient diesel or multi gas 1 Cyl engine, and you can make a system where you can put one or 2 of them in the bed along with any aftermarket gas tank, and now you have something that is "mission configurable".

Re: Ford kills the All-Electric F-150

#760

Post by WorldMaker »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #532

Lots of speculation in this thread. Not a lot of talk about the international market where Ford has been mostly a no-show with the F-150 lightning. Internationally, Toyota and BYD are starting to dominate the electric truck market. The electric Hilux is launching next year and the BYD Shark is doing well in e.g. Australia and Mexico. That's a range extended vehicle similar to the new F-150 sold at an aggressive price…

The article points out that apparently Ford's plan for Europe is rebadging Renault's EVs, which sounds like just giving up on Europe in all but (brand) name.
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