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NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

airqualitynews.com

41–50 of 211 posts

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#41
post #13
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a tariff on DRIVING in Manhattan, the place in America you least need to drive.

You have never tried to leave the city for the suburbs after 9 pm. Driving is still immensely useful, as I sit in my Uber on the way home.

The $9 toll made it worth your money to Uber instead? Seems like your suburb isn't very far. Maybe a train could help you out.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#42
post #20
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They better be. No one’s rooting for the smog, but a congestion tax is pretty regressive (hurts poorer people more)

Not in NYC where less than half the population has access to a car.

This mostly commuters and tradesmen. You aren’t going to get your tools on the train, snd you are driving into the city from white plains or somewhere similar.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#43
post #3

The fact that tolls are now directly useful to the entire public must not be underappreciated. This is good news for everyone.

[flagged]

Ironic that with a headline measuring a negative externality of driving that wasn't being priced in and you think transit got the artificial leg up.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#44
post #15

The fact that tolls are now directly useful to the entire public must not be underappreciated. This is good news for everyone.

They better be. No one’s rooting for the smog, but a congestion tax is pretty regressive (hurts poorer people more)

Many things hurt the poor more, because there are many things that the poor do that have negative externalities that cannot be compensated for by the productivity of the poor. Strict enforcement against violent crime is pretty regressive in that more poor people are incarcerated when this is done. Others are that strict enforcement of traffic laws is pretty regressive; paid parking is regressive; as are fares for buses and trains. Requiring a minimum number of signatures for a ballot proposition is regressive. Allowing more expensive cars to incorporate more advanced safety features is regressive. Requiring grant applications to be carefully written is regressive. As are minimum flying requirements for pilots. DoD medical standards for soldiers are regressive. Officer ASVAB score requirements are regressive. Surgical requirements. Drug approval requirements.

In fact, anything that requires a standard of performance will be regressive. We don't have to subordinate all goals to regression avoidance. In fact, no functioning society does that.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#45
post #20
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They better be. No one’s rooting for the smog, but a congestion tax is pretty regressive (hurts poorer people more)

Not in NYC where less than half the population has access to a car.

The congestion tax has far more impact on people who live and work above 60th or in the outer boroughs or NJ than it does Manhattanites. Retail, wholesale, trades, small businesses and yes commuters in these areas, which are poorer than Manhattan, suffer disproportionately

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#46
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"There is no such thing as a free lunch" is a very strong argument for tolls, I hope you realize. > everyone paying the tolls who now needs to engage in additional pollution-causing economic activity merely to offset the costs of government-mandated congestion pricing I don't think that's how economics work. People are already doing their best to generate money. Also even if that did happen, the thing you're describi…

If people aren't working harder to offset the tolls then they're strictly poorer as a consequence of the toll.

You can say that about any tax. Which makes it extremely unconvincing as an argument against any particular tax, since in the long term money not collected from tax A will be collected from tax B.

(And they have the option of not driving, too.)

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#47
It's frustrating how poorly most people understand economics and the distinction between price and cost. Everybody in the world is being asked to blithely accept the massive unpaid costs of motor vehicle usage. This is a tiny step towards recouping some of this costs. Roadways, parking, collisions, pollution, noise have all be costs born by all of us. And in NYC that's a load of non-drivers. We should be adopting all sorts of policies to pass those costs on to drivers.

People panic over the thought of free buses when we have millions of miles of free roads.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#48
post #6

What did it do to GDP? (Sincerely asking)

No city has reliable data on this for a fleet of reasons. The high quality data tends to show little effect on retail foot traffic, slightly more reliable commute times, and then the wealth of health benefits. Linking this to output seems to be beyond economists for cities that have done something similar (London, Stockholm, Milan, etc)

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#49
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They better be. No one’s rooting for the smog, but a congestion tax is pretty regressive (hurts poorer people more)

Poor people are forced by circumstance to live in the busiest areas so they will get the biggest health benefits and many do not own cars and often do not even own a car space, so I would beg to differ. You can also offset the regressive nature of this taxation (if any) by putting the revenue into subsidizing public infrastructure like rail and bus.

Isn’t it the opposite though? The poor aren’t able to live in the most popular busiest areas, and usually have to live on the fringes of the city. They might train in though. This is mostly going to benefit the rich people who can still afford to live in the city, but with rent control there are still some non-rich people in the city.

Re: NYC congestion pricing cuts air pollution by a fifth in six months

#50
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in NYC where less than half the population has access to a car.

This mostly commuters and tradesmen. You aren’t going to get your tools on the train, snd you are driving into the city from white plains or somewhere similar.

The alternative is the tradesmen can now apply their trade for 30 minutes more each way rather than sit in traffic (probably better overall) That, and apparently they and their kids can breathe easier.
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