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Everyone in Seattle hates AI

jonready.com

751–760 of 1001 posts

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#751

Ok so a few thoughts as a former Seattleite: 1. You were a therapy session for her. Her negativity was about the layoffs. 2. FAANG companies dramatically overhired for years and are using AI as an excuse for layoffs. 3. AI scene in Seattle is pretty good, but as with everywhere else was/is a victim of the AI hype. I see estimates of the hype being dead in a year. AI won't be dead, but throwing money at the whatever U…

Some people really do hate AI, it's not entirely about the layoffs. This is a well insulated bubble but you can find tons of anti-AI forums online.

> Some people really do hate AI

That's probably me for a lot of people. The reality is a bit finer than this namely :

- I hate VC funded AI which is actually super shallow (basically OpenAI/Claude wrappers)

- I hate VC funded genuine BigAI that sells itself as the literal opposite of what it is, e.g. OpenAI... being NOT open.

- I hate AI that hides it's ecological cost. Generating text, videos, etc is actually fascinating, but not if making the shittiest video with the dumbest script is taking the same amount of energy I'd need to fly across the globe.

- I hate AI that hides it's human cost, namely using cheap labor from "far away" where people have to label atrocities (murders, rape, child abuse, etc) without being provided proper psychological support.

- I hate AI that embodies capitalist principles of exploitation. If somehow your entire AI business relies on an entire pyramid of everything listed above to capture a market then hike the price once dependency is entrenched you might be a brilliant business man but you suck as a human being.

etc... I could go on but you get the idea.

I do love open source public AI research though. Several of my very good friends are researchers in universities working on the topic. They are smart, kind and just great human beings. Not fucking ghouls riding the hype with 0 concern for our World.

So... yes maybe AI haters have a slightly more refined perspective but of course when one summarize whatever text they see in 3 words via their favorite LLM, it's hard to see.

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#752
Someone wrote on HN the (IMO) main reason why people do not accept AI.

  AI is about centralisation of power
So basically, only a few companies that hold on the large models will have all the knowledge required to do things, and will lend you your computer collecting monthly fees. Also see https://be-clippy.com/ for more arguments (like Adobe moving to cloud to teach their model on your work).

For me AI is just a natural language query model for texts. So if I need to find something in text, make join with other knowledge etc. things I'd do in SQL if there was an SQL processing natural language, I do in LLM. This enhances my work. However other people seem to feel threatened. I know a person who resigned CS course because AI was solving algorithmic exercises better than him. This might cause global depression, as we no longer are on the "top". Moreover he went to medicine, where people basically will be using AI to diagnose people and AI operators are required (i.e. there are no threats of reductions because of AI in Public Health Service)

So the world is changing, the power is being gathered, there is no longer possibility to "run your local cloud with open office, and a mail server" to take that power from the giants.

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#753
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The more I use AI for coding the more I realize that its a toy for vibe coding/fun projects. Its not for serious work. When you work with a large codebase which have a very high complexity level, then the bugs put in there by AI will not worth the cost of the easily added features.

Many people also program and have no idea what a giant codebase looks like. I know I don't. I have never been paid to write anything beyond a short script. I actually can't even picture what a professional software engineer actually works on day to day. From my perspective, it is completely mind blowing to write my own audio synth in python with Librosa. A library I didn't know existed before LLMs and now I have a fu…

I work on a stock market trading system in a big bank, in Hong Kong.

The code is split between a backend in Java (no GC allowed during trading) and C++ (for algos), a frontend in C# (as complex as the backend, used by 200 traders), and a "new" frontend in Javascript in infinite migration.

Most of the code was made before 2008 but that was the cvs to svn switch so we lost history before that. We have employees dating back 1997 who remembers that platform already existing.

It's made of millions of lines of code, hundreds of people worked on it, it does intricate things in 10 stock markets across Asia (we have no clue how the others in US or EU do, not really at least - it's not the same rules, market vendors, protocols etc)

Sometimes I need to configure new trading robots for random little thing we want to do automatically and I ask the AI the company is shoving down our throat. It is HOPELESS, literally hopeless. I had to write a review to my manager who will never pass it along up the ladder for fear of their response that was absolutely destructive. It cannot understand the code let alone write some, it cannot write the tests, it cannot generate configuration, it cannot help in anything. It's always wrong, it never gets it, it doesn't know what the fuck these 20 different repos of thousands of files are and how they connect to each other, why it's in so many languages, why it's so quirky sometimes.

Should we change it all to make it AI compatible, or give up ? Fuck do I know... When I started working on it 7 years ago coming from little startups doing little things, it took me a few weeks to totally get the philosophy of it all and be productive. It's really not that hard, it's just really really really really large, so you have to embrace certain ways of working (for instance, you'll do bugs, and you'll find them too late, and you'll apologize in post mortems, dont be paralized by it). AIs costing all that money to be so dumb and useless, are disappointing :(

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#754

Ok so a few thoughts as a former Seattleite: 1. You were a therapy session for her. Her negativity was about the layoffs. 2. FAANG companies dramatically overhired for years and are using AI as an excuse for layoffs. 3. AI scene in Seattle is pretty good, but as with everywhere else was/is a victim of the AI hype. I see estimates of the hype being dead in a year. AI won't be dead, but throwing money at the whatever U…

The hate starts with the name. LLMs don't have the I in AI. It's like marketing a car as self-driving while all it can do is lane assist.

See also hoverboards

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#755
post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Industries are built upon shit people built in their basements, get hacking

I am! No one's interested in any of it though...

You need to buy fake stars on github, fake download it 2 millions time a day and ask an AI to spam about it on twitter/linkedin.

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#756

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outside of tech, I think the opinion is generally negative. AI has lost a lot the narrative due to things like energy prices and layoffs.

ChatGPT is one of the most used websites in the world and it's used by the most normal people in the world, in what way is the opinion "generally negative"?

Seemingly the primary economic beneficiaries of AI are people who own companies and manage people. What this means for the average person working for a living is probably a lot of change, additional uncertainty, and additional reductions in their standard of living. Rich get richer, poor get poorer, and they aren't rich.

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#757

Someone wrote on HN the (IMO) main reason why people do not accept AI. AI is about centralisation of power So basically, only a few companies that hold on the large models will have all the knowledge required to do things, and will lend you your computer collecting monthly fees. Also see https://be-clippy.com/ for more arguments (like Adobe moving to cloud to teach their model on your work). For me AI is just a natur…

but the opposite is actually true. u can use ai to bypass a lot of SaaS solutions

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#758

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same in Danish FWIW. In English, I’d pronounce it very similar to “wonderful”.

If OP dropped the g, it would be a MUCh better product name.

this would make it even closer to the dangerously similar travel planning app "wanderlog"

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#759

Someone wrote on HN the (IMO) main reason why people do not accept AI. AI is about centralisation of power So basically, only a few companies that hold on the large models will have all the knowledge required to do things, and will lend you your computer collecting monthly fees. Also see https://be-clippy.com/ for more arguments (like Adobe moving to cloud to teach their model on your work). For me AI is just a natur…

but the opposite is actually true. u can use ai to bypass a lot of SaaS solutions

So you are saying now that you can bypass a lot of solutions offered by a mix of small/large providers by using a single solution from a huge provider, this is the opposite of a centralization of power?

Re: Everyone in Seattle hates AI

#760

Someone wrote on HN the (IMO) main reason why people do not accept AI. AI is about centralisation of power So basically, only a few companies that hold on the large models will have all the knowledge required to do things, and will lend you your computer collecting monthly fees. Also see https://be-clippy.com/ for more arguments (like Adobe moving to cloud to teach their model on your work). For me AI is just a natur…

But why not? AI also has very powerful open models (that can actually be fine-tuned for personal use) that can compete against the flagship proprietary models.

As an average consumer, I actually feel like i'm less locked into gemini/chatgpt/claude than I am to Apple or Google for other tech (i.e. photos).

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