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Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

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Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#241

Post by Kuinox »

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #229
Kuinox wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you played in this era ? - If you were too good on some server, you'd get banned. - If the admin doesn't know well cheating, he could tolerate something that was obvious cheating. - Cheaters could just change server often. It used to be easy to just ban peoples yes, and it was as easy to switch servers. Plus on most competitive game today, you have custom lobbies, which do exactly what you want, and there is a re…

Custom lobbies don't meet the same need. That's for playing with your friends, or at least, people you vet yourself. Community servers are a sub-community in of themselves: people tend to play on the same servers on a regular basis, allowing you to build rapport, community norms, and have substantially more direct moderation than company-run servers. Yes, sometimes you run into power-tripping moderators. That comes w…

two or three months ago, I played a game that did exactly what you proposed, V-Rising, it have a server browser, I played a week with friend on a busy server. Then the server was gone for two weeks. When it was back, mosts of the bases were gone due to inactivity.

That's the kind of things that were common too, maybe you forgot about it.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#242

Post by Mindwipe »

trinix912 wrote: post #117
embedding-shape wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s fundamentally incompatible with open source Yeah, I mean why would they open source their anti-cheats, would defeat the purpose, wouldn't it? Not sure why you bring up OSS here, it isn't relevant in the least, plenty of non-OSS runs on Linux even though Linux and more is OSS.

Because with Windows, MS can put a list of trusted rootkit anticheats in the kernel and that cannot be changed (without having the source or breaking signatures when hex editing etc). If Linux did the same, anyone could recompile the kernel with their fake anticheat’s signature. The fake anticheat would then present itself as real to the game. One could go as far as to rewrite the relevant syscall to falsely indicate…

The OEM could control it in hardware and a secure part of the chipset could validate the OS integrity and sign the relevant key (which is what Apple does with SIP on a managed MacOS installation).

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#243

Post by chownie »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #200
chownie wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would much rather my 45 minute game be disrupted and the user booted permanently by moderators VS every game be disrupted for months while the developers try and work out which parts of my privacy they can invade to maybe hopefully boot the cheaters.

What about everyone else?

Re-read the comment but with generosity in your heart? I don't think you need it explained.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#244

Post by jszymborski »

999900000999 wrote: post #236
i80and wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a pretty prolific gamer, but at the start of the year I finally kicked Windows to the curb. It's been fine . Surprisingly few games I'm interested in to begin with have anticheat that doesn't work on Linux, and it's comforting to know games aren't allowed to just shove trash into kernel space at will.

The thing is I still need Windows for music production. Linux will never compete here.

They said this about gaming too... all it takes is Valve-esque sponsor

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#245

Post by vel0city »

LanceH wrote: post #151

Amongst the discussion of rootkits and anti-cheat, I would like to add that part of the reason it is necessary is caused by the game companies that took away the standard method of playing multiplayer -- players running their own servers. It used to be pretty easy to just ban people from playing, now we're 100% reliant on their ability to do it. So we have anti-cheat which roots our computer, and still doesn't 100% s…

> It used to be pretty easy to just ban people from playing

I ran servers for a lot of games. It was often difficult to ban people from playing. First off, someone with ban permissions would have to actually be online at the time. So often nothing would happen at all, you'd just have to leave and find a different server. Second, one could get banned, often just change their IP or use a different CD key or whatever other identifier the game used, and hop back on with a new identity.

Meanwhile discoverability of similarly skilled matches were a challenge, along with actually playing with a group of friends against new people. Its not some perfect panacea, there are a lot of things people disliked about picking private servers to play on.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#246

Post by chownie »

Kuinox wrote: post #206
stronglikedan wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

more likely volunteers when they're running their own servers

volunteers which aren't necessarly pro player and cant distinguish good players from smart cheaters.

The developers aren't pro players either, the cutting edge for anti-cheats still require that non-cheaters play with cheaters for months. I would not be shocked if simple vote-kick outperforms every anti-cheat on the market.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#247

Post by pjmlp »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #213

It will be interesting to see how this evolves. It used to be that game developers could safely ignore Linux. But with a growing number of Steam OS, Steam Deck, and Linux + Steam users gaming, it's going to get increasingly more painful in terms of revenue to be telling those users "our game only works on Windows" and just miss out on the revenue and deal with the angry users, forums full of users complaining the gam…

They are still ignoring Linux, hence why Valve is using Proton, the validation they failed to convince studios to care, studios that happen to target systems like Android NDK, or use platform agnostic engines.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#249

Post by Kuinox »

chownie wrote: post #246
Kuinox wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

volunteers which aren't necessarly pro player and cant distinguish good players from smart cheaters.

The developers aren't pro players either, the cutting edge for anti-cheats still require that non-cheaters play with cheaters for months. I would not be shocked if simple vote-kick outperforms every anti-cheat on the market.

A simple vote-kick will kick, will kick so much players that doesn't cheat. It's already used to troll in games like CS.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#250

Post by vablings »

xeonmc wrote: post #231
nevon wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't send the client information about players they should not be able to see based on their current position.

And under such system, how do you stop people from abusing latency-compensation to make their character appear out of thin air on the opponent’s perspective by fake-juking a corner to trick the netcode into not sending the initial trajectory of your peeks?

Fortnite had this same issue when BR was first released. It was promptly fixed after cheaters started abusing it by adding more stringent checks.
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