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6B Miles Driven

tesla.com

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Re: 6B Miles Driven

#51

Post by rconti »

josephcsible wrote: post #28
rconti wrote: post #24

I have a 2018 Model 3 with basic autopilot. I have an FSD question. Does FSD have different driving behaviors from basic autopilot? I'm not saying "capabilities"; obviously it has more capabilities, but I mean the actual driving choices. I get that FSD (maybe) has/requires better hardware than my car. But what I hate about autopilot is all around basic driving: * Lane centering. It's extremely aggressive about lane c…

FSD doesn't drive like that. It's a completely different software stack, not just Autopilot with extra capabilities.

It strikes me as incredibly weird to maintain two separate stacks, especially because FSD was "available" when I bought my car. In retrospect, though, I guess it wasn't actually available to use, just for purchase.

So I suppose they had a parallel development process for FSD while building autopilot features?

But since there is a hardware support overlap, it seems like at some point you'd migrate autopilot cars to the FSD software stack, with limitations added in via feature flags.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#52

Post by para_parolu »

DarmokJalad1701 wrote: post #7

I use it every single day and it is amazing! I have had my car for 6+ years now and it has only gotten better. Starting with "Navigate on Autopilot" when I originally got the car in 2019 which was pretty janky, it has only gotten better and better (with the rare regression in some cases). As of the last year or so, I don't even have to touch the steering wheel anymore!

It is a miracle consumer technology but it does mistakes. I have 40k miles in last 2 years mostly using fsd (since v13). And my anecdotal experience is that it drives itself well until it doesn’t. So far I was lucky enough to pay attention when it was critical. Which is hard to do because car doing good most of the time.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#53

Post by jhot »

But how many of those miles are spent hanging out in the left lane of a highway while other drivers, having to pass on the right, send death stares to the person in the passenger seat?

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#54

Post by prmoustache »

Marketing page with data from the brand. Conclusion: those numbers aren't worth anything, unless they come from independant organism they are just advertising and no more believable than old cigarettes ads.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#55

Post by DarmokJalad1701 »

tomrod wrote: post #48
DarmokJalad1701 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and this page is quite light on details of what they’re comparing to what In the page: "If FSD (Supervised) was active at any point within five seconds leading up to a collision event, Tesla considers the collision to have occurred with FSD (Supervised) engaged for purposes of calculating collision rates for the Vehicle Safety Report." They are pretty open about how the stats are reported.

Who chooses to turn off FSD? You really can't trust almost anything Musk says, he's proven this time and again, and Tesla will reflect that in its culture.

> Who chooses to turn off FSD?

The driver can at any time. And they do if it seems like it is going to do something stupid - which is getting rarer and rarer as time goes on. As a Level 2 system, the driver is always supposed to supervise the operation and stay alert.

Musk has proven time and again that things his critics say are impossible/unrealistic ends up being achieved late. See anything from reusing rocket stages to the goals from Tesla's 2018 Compensation Plan[1] ("If Mr. Musk were somehow to increase the value of Tesla to $650 billion — a figure many experts would contend is laughably impossible and would make Tesla one of the five largest companies in the United States ...")

Or the Arianespace guy saying SpaceX is "selling a dream". To quote: "I think a $5 million launch or a $15 million launch is a bit of a dream. Personally, I think reusability is a dream."

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/23/business/dealbook/tesla-e...

[2] https://arstechnica.com/space/2024/06/some-european-launch-o...

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#56

Post by cogman10 »

mschulkind wrote: post #36
rconti wrote: post #24

I have a 2018 Model 3 with basic autopilot. I have an FSD question. Does FSD have different driving behaviors from basic autopilot? I'm not saying "capabilities"; obviously it has more capabilities, but I mean the actual driving choices. I get that FSD (maybe) has/requires better hardware than my car. But what I hate about autopilot is all around basic driving: * Lane centering. It's extremely aggressive about lane c…

Basic autopilot is unrelated to FSD these days. Every aspect is improved. Isn't there a trial you can try?

A 2018 vehicle is 2 major version behind on the FSD it can use. Tesla is on v14 and 2018 vehicles are stuck on v12.

There's been rumors of a v14 lite coming out because tesla REALLY doesn't want to deal with the fact that they promised the 2018s could be fully autonomous.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#57

Post by kristofferR »

brettgriffin wrote: post #45
kristofferR wrote: post #23

So Tesla is charging $8000 to activate full safety software features in their vehicles? How is this not way more controversial than having to pay extra to activate features like heated steering wheels in other brands?

> So Tesla is charging $8000 to activate full safety software features in their vehicles? I think you're being obtuse, but to be clear, many car manufacturers offer trims don't include features that would qualify making the car 'safer' - blind spot detection, back up cameras (I think these are legally required now but were a premium feature for over a decade), parking assistance, crash detection, etc. I have a Tesla…

Well, I think that is also morally reprehensible in all other cases where it's also a matter of activating software safety features.

Most of the things you mentioned aren't software locked behind a paywall, hopefully, you don't swipe your credit card and get those features added via OTA in minutes. If your car doesn't have back seat airbags it's hopefully not because you haven't paid for the back seat airbag in-app purchase.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#58

Post by stldev »

silexia wrote: post #2

Pretty amazing to have driven six billion miles with 7x less major accidents. How many lives have been saved?

Are they saving lives? The latest NHTSA FARS analysis I saw (iSeeCars, report is through 2022) shows Tesla at 5.6 fatalities per billion miles vs the 2.8 average.

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#59

Post by rconti »

mschulkind wrote: post #36
rconti wrote: post #24

I have a 2018 Model 3 with basic autopilot. I have an FSD question. Does FSD have different driving behaviors from basic autopilot? I'm not saying "capabilities"; obviously it has more capabilities, but I mean the actual driving choices. I get that FSD (maybe) has/requires better hardware than my car. But what I hate about autopilot is all around basic driving: * Lane centering. It's extremely aggressive about lane c…

Basic autopilot is unrelated to FSD these days. Every aspect is improved. Isn't there a trial you can try?

Honestly, I just dismiss all of the promos they throw at me.

Just yesterday I got an ad in the app "refer a friend and try FSD (supervised), and get $15!"

So I opened up the app just now and I suppose I got my answer that proves my initial premise was incorrect -- I need a hardware upgrade for FSD. Womp womp.

(That said, it still seems like the lane centering and brake/throttle behavior should have been easily fixed without a FSD hardware upgrade).

Re: 6B Miles Driven

#60

Post by josephcsible »

rconti wrote: post #51
josephcsible wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FSD doesn't drive like that. It's a completely different software stack, not just Autopilot with extra capabilities.

It strikes me as incredibly weird to maintain two separate stacks, especially because FSD was "available" when I bought my car. In retrospect, though, I guess it wasn't actually available to use, just for purchase. So I suppose they had a parallel development process for FSD while building autopilot features? But since there is a hardware support overlap, it seems like at some point you'd migrate autopilot cars to th…

Autopilot basically hasn't gotten any new features since FSD came out.

> But since there is a hardware support overlap, it seems like at some point you'd migrate autopilot cars to the FSD software stack, with limitations added in via feature flags.

This is exactly what a lot of people speculate will happen soon.

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