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Steam Frame

store.steampowered.com

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Re: Steam Frame

#251

Post by monocasa »

cube2222 wrote: post #181
monocasa wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is that I'd expect foveated rendering to increase latency issues, not help them like it does for bandwidth concerns. During a lag spike you're now looking at an extremely down sampled image instead of what in non foveated rendering had been just as high quality. Now I also wonder if an ML model could also work to help predict fovea location based on screen content and recent eye trackng data. If the eyes ar…

My understanding is that the foveated rendering would reduce bandwidth requirements enough that latency spikes become effectively non-existent. We’ll see in practice - so far all hands-on reviewers said the foveated rendering worked great, with one trying to break it (move eyes quickly left right up down from edge to edge) and not being able to - the foveated rendering always being faster. I agree latency spikes woul…

Enough bandwidth to absolve any latency issues over a wireless connection is not really a thing for a low latency use case like foveated rendering.

What do you do when another device on the main wifi network decides to eat 50ms of time in the channel you use for the eye tracking data return path?

Re: Steam Frame

#252

Post by circuit10 »

One of the most interesting parts of this to me that not many people are talking about is what their approach will be to making Steam games work on ARM…

I assume they will have put a lot of work into an emulation layer (maybe an existing one like FEX) to make it usable similar to what they did with Proton? This could be really good for the Linux ARM ecosystem in general

Re: Steam Frame

#253

Post by RyJones »

andoando wrote: post #237
Insanity wrote: post #70

This is going to be an instant buy for me, and my first VR device ever. I've used the previous Steam VR headset over at a friends' place many times, but never bit the bullet to get one myself. The fact that this can run standalone, doesn't have a bunch of wires dangling from it, and is pretty much a fully working Linux box makes this am almost on-brainer for me. I do _hope_ the price is reasonable though, if it ends…

I bought the original Steam Index and pretty much never used it again cause its such a mess to have around. That plus the motion sickness. For applications where you're moving around in game though Id really want to try it again.

from your keyboard to GabeN's ears. I've spent a lot of dollars supporting my local startup; it was mostly wasted.

Re: Steam Frame

#254

Post by modeless »

JeremyNT wrote: post #249
modeless wrote: post #60

Foveated streaming! That's a great idea. Foveated rendering is complicated to implement with current rendering APIs in a way that actually improves performance, but foveated streaming seems like a much easier win that applies to all content automatically. And the dedicated 6 GHz dongle should do a much better job at streaming than typical wifi routers. > Just like any SteamOS device, install your own apps, open a bro…

I guess there's a market for this but I'm personally disappointed that they've gone with the "cram a computer into the headset" route. I'd much rather have a simpler, more compact dumb device like the Bigscreen Beyond 2, which in exchange should prove much lighter and more comfortable to wear for long time periods. The bulk and added component cost of the "all in one" PC/headset models is just unnecessary if you alre…

You can get a Beyond if that's what you want. It's an amazing device, and will be far more comfortable and higher resolution than this one. Valve has supported Bigscreen in integrating Lighthouse tracking, and I hope that they continue that support by somehow allowing them to integrate the inside-out tracking they've developed for this device in the next version of the Beyond.

Re: Steam Frame

#255

Post by ch4s3 »

rtkwe wrote: post #209
ch4s3 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mouth tracking? What a vile thought in the context of the steam… catalogue.

They're probably thinking of it in comparison to the Apple Pro which attempts to do some facial tracking of the bottom of your face to inform their 'Personas', it notably still fails quite badly on bearded people where it can't see the bottom half of the face well.

I gathered as much, but still.

Re: Steam Frame

#256

Post by preisschild »

JeremyNT wrote: post #249
modeless wrote: post #60

Foveated streaming! That's a great idea. Foveated rendering is complicated to implement with current rendering APIs in a way that actually improves performance, but foveated streaming seems like a much easier win that applies to all content automatically. And the dedicated 6 GHz dongle should do a much better job at streaming than typical wifi routers. > Just like any SteamOS device, install your own apps, open a bro…

I guess there's a market for this but I'm personally disappointed that they've gone with the "cram a computer into the headset" route. I'd much rather have a simpler, more compact dumb device like the Bigscreen Beyond 2, which in exchange should prove much lighter and more comfortable to wear for long time periods. The bulk and added component cost of the "all in one" PC/headset models is just unnecessary if you alre…

I agree. Hopefully Bigscreen continues making hardware. I still have the original bigscreen beyond and im very happy with it besides the glare.

Re: Steam Frame

#257

Post by bspammer »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #243
nabakin wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And foveated streaming has a 1-2ms wireless latency on modern GPUs according to LTT. Insane.

Wow, that's just 1 frame of latency at 60 fps. Edit: Nevermind, I'm dumb. 1/60th of a second is 16 milliseconds, not 1.6 milliseconds.

Much less than, 1 frame is 16ms

Re: Steam Frame

#258

Post by preisschild »

modeless wrote: post #254
JeremyNT wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess there's a market for this but I'm personally disappointed that they've gone with the "cram a computer into the headset" route. I'd much rather have a simpler, more compact dumb device like the Bigscreen Beyond 2, which in exchange should prove much lighter and more comfortable to wear for long time periods. The bulk and added component cost of the "all in one" PC/headset models is just unnecessary if you alre…

You can get a Beyond if that's what you want. It's an amazing device, and will be far more comfortable and higher resolution than this one. Valve has supported Bigscreen in integrating Lighthouse tracking, and I hope that they continue that support by somehow allowing them to integrate the inside-out tracking they've developed for this device in the next version of the Beyond.

That would probably add a lot of extra weight and it would need to make the device bigger.

Re: Steam Frame

#259

Post by preisschild »

circuit10 wrote: post #252

One of the most interesting parts of this to me that not many people are talking about is what their approach will be to making Steam games work on ARM… I assume they will have put a lot of work into an emulation layer (maybe an existing one like FEX) to make it usable similar to what they did with Proton? This could be really good for the Linux ARM ecosystem in general

Apparently they are heavily funding FEX-emu now and are using that

Re: Steam Frame

#260

Post by modeless »

preisschild wrote: post #258
modeless wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get a Beyond if that's what you want. It's an amazing device, and will be far more comfortable and higher resolution than this one. Valve has supported Bigscreen in integrating Lighthouse tracking, and I hope that they continue that support by somehow allowing them to integrate the inside-out tracking they've developed for this device in the next version of the Beyond.

That would probably add a lot of extra weight and it would need to make the device bigger.

I don't think it would be too bad. Cameras are tiny. The processing would still happen on the PC, and you could delete the lighthouse tracking sensors. I guess the hardest part would be sending that much camera data back to the PC over the cable.
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