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GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

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Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#91
"Warmer and more conversational" - they're basically admitting GPT-5 was too robotic. The real tell here is splitting into Instant vs Thinking models explicitly. They've given up on the unified model dream and are now routing queries like everyone else (Anthropic's been doing this, Google's Gemini too).

Calling it "GPT-5.1 Thinking" instead of o3-mini or whatever is interesting branding. They're trying to make reasoning models feel less like a separate product line and more like a mode. Smart move if they can actually make the router intelligent enough to know when to use it without explicit prompting.

Still waiting for them to fix the real issue: the model's pathological need to apologize for everything and hedge every statement lol.

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#92
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. If i tell it to choose A or B, I want it to output either “A” or “B”. I don’t want an essay of 10 pages about how this is exactly the right question to ask

10 pages about the question means that the subsequent answer is more likely to be correct. That's why they repeat themselves.

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Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#93

All the examples of "warmer" generations show that OpenAI's definition of warmer is synonymous with sycophantic , which is a surprise given all the criticism against that particular aspect of ChatGPT. I suspect this approach is a direct response to the backlash against removing 4o.

Man I miss Claude 2 - it acted like it was a busy person people inexplicably kept bothering with random questions

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#94
post #82
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what the personality selector is for: you can just pick 'Efficient' (formerly Robot) and it does a good job of answering tersely? https://share.cleanshot.com/9kBDGs7Q

Unfortunately, I also don't want other people to interact with a sycophantic robot friend, yet my picker only applies to my conversation

Sorry that you can't control other peoples lives & wants

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#95
I've been using GPT-5.1-thinking for the last week or so, it's been horrendous. It does not spend as much time thinking as GPT-5 does, and the results are significantly worse (e.g. obvious mistakes) and less technical. I suspect this is to save on inference compute.

I've temporarily switched back to o3, thankfully that model is still in the switcher.

edit: s/month/week

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#96

FYI ChatGPT has a “custom instructions” setting in the personalization setting where you can ask it to lay off the idiotic insincere flattery. I recently added this: > Do not compliment me for asking a smart or insightful question. Directly give the answer. And I’ve not been annoyed since. I bet that whatever crap they layer on in 5.1 is undone as easily.

Also "Never apologize."

Note even today, negation doesn't work as well as affirmative direction.

"Do not use jargon", or, "never apologize", work less well than "avoid jargon" or "avoid apologizing".

Better to give it something to do than something that should be absent (same problem with humans: "don't think of a pink elephant").

See also target fixation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Target_fixation

Making this headline apropos:

https://www.cycleworld.com/sport-rider/motorcycle-riding-ski...

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#98
when 4o was going thru it's ultra-sycophantic phase, I had a talk with it about Graham Hancock (Ancient Apocalypse, alt-history guy).

It agreed with everything Hancock claims with just a little encouragement ("Yes! Bimini road is almost certainly an artifact of Atlantis!")

gpt5 on the other hand will at most say the ideas are "interesting".

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#99
post #60
post #11

I don't want a more conversational GPT. I want the _exact_ opposite. I want a tool with the upper limit of "conversation" being something like LCARS from Star Trek. This is quite disappointing as a current ChatGPT subscriber.

That's what the personality selector is for: you can just pick 'Efficient' (formerly Robot) and it does a good job of answering tersely? https://share.cleanshot.com/9kBDGs7Q

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Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#100
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? You can opt out of training, and delete history, do they keep the prompts somehow?!

It's not simply "training". What's the point of training on prompts? You can't learn the answer to a question by training on the question. For Anthropic at least it's also opt-in not opt-out afaik.

I think the prompts might actually really useful for training, especially for generating synthetic data.
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