Here’s an informing recent DevTools podcast episode featuring someone from the Marko team, https://www.devtools.fm/episode/
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Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
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Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#82It looks interesting and in a past life I probably would have tried it out but do you know why I like React? Because it's just JavaScript. This ` ` and ` ` syntax is awful.
To each their own. This syntax actially resonates with some people, which is why template-based frameworks like Vue and Svelte are also popular. In fact, at first glance this reminds me a lot Vue in some of its approach and syntax.
BTW - with Vue you can use entirely JSX of you dislike HTML component syntax (I don’t know enough about Svelte to know if it allows the same).
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#83For those curious, the Marko team created a HN clone to showcase Marko 6
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#84It looks interesting and in a past life I probably would have tried it out but do you know why I like React? Because it's just JavaScript. This ` ` and ` ` syntax is awful.
To each their own. This syntax actially resonates with some people, which is why template-based frameworks like Vue and Svelte are also popular. In fact, at first glance this reminds me a lot Vue in some of its approach and syntax. BTW - with Vue you can use entirely JSX of you dislike HTML component syntax (I don’t know enough about Svelte to know if it allows the same).
Svelte does not allow that.
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#85It looks interesting and in a past life I probably would have tried it out but do you know why I like React? Because it's just JavaScript. This ` ` and ` ` syntax is awful.
Really, this point can't be stated often enough. It was my reason for switching to React when I learned TypeScript after getting more into JS frameworks via Vue.JS. My starting point was Vue 2.7, and I started out using string templates haha :) Even wrote some reactive custom code (without Vue, just regular DOM code) in a customer widget that utilized Object.defineProperty et al, inspired by Vue. And today, while I'm…
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Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#86After two decades of this churn we are back to the equivalent of JSP. It was the correct paradigm all along but millennials wouldn't be caught dead working with such a "lame" technology so they bestowed SPA on us and now they are slowly walking it back.
Yes, we go in circles, but there are subtle (and sometimes not so subtle) improvements every iteration. Of course sometimes there are also dead ends. It is exciting to see what the ingenuity of the next group brings, even though some existing things are lost, but hopefully not forgotten.
This.
Also it cannot be understated: apis, language and tooling are miles ahead better they were a decade ago or more.
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#87After two decades of this churn we are back to the equivalent of JSP. It was the correct paradigm all along but millennials wouldn't be caught dead working with such a "lame" technology so they bestowed SPA on us and now they are slowly walking it back.
I’d venture to say that the idea of a “correct paradigm” is based on a false premise. Why would there be one paradigm to rule them all? Maybe there is more nuance. Maybe certain paradigms are better for certain applications.
I'd go a bit further and say certain paradigms may be better for certain people.
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#88[deleted]
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#89It looks interesting and in a past life I probably would have tried it out but do you know why I like React? Because it's just JavaScript. This ` ` and ` ` syntax is awful.
I mostly agree with you but React isn’t just JavaScript. JSX is not JavaScript. It’s just that we’re so used to it we don’t consider it notable any more. Worth keeping in mind when you’re looking at a brand new framework.
I mean, you’re technically correct. But you’re also not understanding the point.
What people mean when they say “React is just JavaScript” is…
1) JSX, more than any other templating system, is just HTML interleaved with JavaScript. It’s HTML, and anything between { and } is evaluated as JavaScript.
2) Inserting a React component’s “HTML tag” in your JSX is _actually_ the same as calling the JavaScript function. The HTML attributes are the function arguments. Yes, inside your function there can be state, and there can be contexts, and there are refs. But you get at all of those things by calling JavaScript functions.
Like,
{MyComponent({ attr: “yes” })}
I feel like too many people think “React is Just JavaScript” is some kind of lie people tell to make React sound cool.
It’s not a lie. There’s a _small_ amount of hand waving around the word “just” but the point is, it’s WAY smaller than what you need to explain the ways Svelte or Vue or Angular diverge from plain JavaScript.
Re: Marko – A declarative, HTML‑based language
#90I didn't look deep into Marko yet, but in my opinion JSX is by far the best HTML template language there is. And it's not restricted to React. Most other template languages hits serious limitations really fast. I tried and hated (for non trivial things): Angular, Handlebars, Razor (dotnet) and Vue (which does support JSX optionally).
I written lots of Vue/angular/react (like more than 3 major projects with each) and I'm a firm believer that:
1. Jsx is nicer to write but that's a non issue
2. vue's and angular's directives and bindings lend themselves to much saner and lighter rendering (performance does matter)
3. Vue is much easier to tame, it's reactivity model does not require a PhD in hooks or a deep understanding of React's internals. It just works out of the box as it should and is much easier to control the rendering lifecycle.
At the end of the day, after many years, my preference goes with Vue and Nuxt especially which is tremendously better than the monsters of Next or RR. That's what pays the bill the easiest and is eventually easier to maintain and optimize.