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I Want You to Understand Chicago

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Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#91

Post by casenmgreen »

hexbin010 wrote: post #83
andix wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that's a reason to call the cops and report an abduction. Sorry, I'm a stupid European, that how we would handle such a situation.

I hate to invoke the comparison, and not to diminish the Holocaust at all, but to give you a better idea of what's happening in the US right now: what's happening could be compared to the Gestapo rounding up the Jews. Innocent people are being rounded up by a faceless secret police, violently, in a terrorising manner, and taken to detention centres, with their human rights abused at every stage, with no due process a…

It seems to me exactly the same.

An arbitrary group has been selected as being an enemy, they are used to present justifications for breaking law and due process, you then develop a large organization (Gestapo/ICE) accustomed to following orders and ignoring the law - if you're going to subvert the political system, you need to possess the means to force you will on the population. You need a large group of men who will perform violence when ordered to do so, regardless of law and due process.

I mean we all know where this is going. There are not going to be free and fair elections again. This isn't a blip, it's a plan.

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#92

Post by andix »

rommelsLegacy wrote: post #85
andix wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that's a reason to call the cops and report an abduction. Sorry, I'm a stupid European, that how we would handle such a situation.

as a european then you really should know since a lot of us had dictatorships and secret police. the gestapo wasnt that long ago and most european communist states had the same issues good luck calling the police

I've never lived in a dictatorship, but I know a lot of people who did, and told me their stories.

But from reading this article I couldn't tell if there is a massive crime surge in Chicago, or if it's police brutality, or both. Which is funny, because the article claims to explain ("I want you to understand").

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#93

Post by galangalalgol »

carterschonwald wrote: post #28

This shit is so fucked up. And at a certain level I’m disappointed that we are still trying to fix it peaceably when every day of delay, there is irreparable harm to physical wellness, mental health and rights as citizens or residents. Also science in America is fucked for the next decade.

Violent resolution of the situation would almost certainly result in a society with even fewer freedoms. That is the historical lesson. Violent resistance to authoritarian takeovers gives them an air of legitimacy they need. That is the whole point of chicago and the attempt in Portland. They want violent resistance to justify crack downs. Instead they look like storm troopers. I am in awe of the restraint of those living in Chicago. Ice hasn't done half as much in Texas and they are getting ambushed with assault rifles. That doesn't work with their narrative of lawless blue states though. The ability of Chicagoans to resist peacefully, endure, and document these events may well be what gives the US another chance at being a democracy.

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#94

Post by queenkjuul »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #30
ryandrake wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is how many people enthusiastically voted for this madness, lawlessness and cruelty, and are still cheering it on. You can say "vote, vote, vote," and maybe it will work in 2026 or 2028, or 2030 or whenever, but the root problem is not going away: you are still surrounded by people all over the country who want this.

Margin of victory was ~2M votes, about how many voters 55+ die in a year. Hopefully enough voters have aged out or learned their lesson next time around (considering election results we've seen in the last week or so [1]). You're never going to convince unsavory voters to vote with empathy, the subject brain structure does not support it (anterior insular cortex, primarily), you can only hope they're aging out of the…

Sadly GenX seems to be getting on board as quickly as the boomers are dying off

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#95

Post by giraffe_lady »

pizlonator wrote: post #17

This is really sad to read! Can folks who live in Chicago confirm/deny/comment on the extent to which this article gets it right? (I have no reason to believe that it's an exaggeration, but I sincerely hope that it is.)

Every bit of it is true and there's more that he doesn't mention, probably because it's not as well documented yet.

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#96

Post by crooked-v »

andix wrote: post #86
amouat wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all the same people. If you really don't know, a few of the incidents are here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/videos/c6299nrj76yo

I suspected that it's about immigration agents. But it's just really funny how the article claims to explain the issues, without actually explaining it. Why do they use weapons extensively? Are they chasing violent people who shot at them earlier, or just for fun? It just raises more questions, and doesn't help understanding the situation at all.

They use weapons extensively because they're overwhelmingly barely physically capable of the role (https://www.newsweek.com/dhs-responds-report-ice-recruits-fa...) and get 8 weeks of training with no military or law enforcement experience required (https://old.reddit.com/r/ICE_Raids/comments/1mrdh6r/fyi_ice_...).

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#98

Post by queenkjuul »

HeinzStuckeIt wrote: post #16
alangibson wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voting is what got us in to this. This is supported by a majority of the US. You do not live in the country you think you do.

> This is supported by a majority of the US. The election was fairly close. The winning candidate got elected by a coalition of people with differing views on an number of individual items within his platform. That does not equate to certain approval by the majority of the American population of any of the things the linked article recounts. All that said, as an American living abroad who votes left, the use of terms…

Many of these people are documented permanent residents or US citizens being grabbed without warrants, without being read rights, without charges, and without an opportunity to present documentation.

That's kidnapping.

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#99

Post by galangalalgol »

lurk2 wrote: post #69
daseiner1 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

citizens shooting other citizens is radically different than the federal government lighting legal protections on fire and then pissing on the ashes. wholly disingenuous to compare the two. but yours is the standard misdirect on anything "Chicago" so I'm confident being disingenuous was intentional.

What legal protections are being infringed upon?

The 4th amendment it would seem? Wrongful arrest, unlawful search and seizure, aggravated assault with a lethal weapon...

Re: I Want You to Understand Chicago

#100

Post by kasey_junk »

pizlonator wrote: post #17

This is really sad to read! Can folks who live in Chicago confirm/deny/comment on the extent to which this article gets it right? (I have no reason to believe that it's an exaggeration, but I sincerely hope that it is.)

My kids school has started doing drills with the students in what to do when ice shows up. Like they do for tornadoes. They need to because ICE is using schools as raid locations every day.
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