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James Watson has died

nytimes.com

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Re: James Watson has died

#81

Post by culi »

sharadov wrote: post #39

Wasn't his partner Crick high on LSD when he discovered the double-helix structure of DNA?

There wasn't ever a "moment" when they "discovered" the structure of DNA.

The closest thing is Franklin's Photograph 51 which took about 100 hours to compile and then took another year to do all the calculations to confirm the position of each atom.

Watson and Crick (without the consent of Franklin) saw this Photograph, did some quick analysis, and came up with a couple of models that could match Franklin's photograph. Watson and Crick were already at work trying to crack the model of DNA, but once they got access to Franklin's work, it became the entire basis of their modeling. After about 2 months of this they finally found the double helix structure that matched Franklin's findings.

I doubt Crick was on LSD for an entire 2 months. Perhaps he was tripping when he first viewed the photograph?

Re: James Watson has died

#83

Post by efilife »

terminalshort wrote: post #62
JKCalhoun wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wow, good genes! Said with irony? I mean, the guy was into eugenics—thought some races are smarter than others.

> the guy was into eugenics So are you (probably). Do you think incest should be legalized? > thought some races are smarter than others What other conclusion can you reasonably come to based on the available data?

[flagged]

Re: James Watson has died

#84

Post by efilife »

LarsDu88 wrote: post #78
flkiwi wrote: post #38

[flagged]

Watson is one of the most openly racist and sexist public figures I've ever seen in person. Also he devoted the last 15 years of his life obsessed with longevity. Dude took anti-oxidants, tennis, and Vitamin C up the wazoo to keep living longer.

looks like it paid off

Re: James Watson has died

#85

Post by Aurornis »

LarsDu88 wrote: post #71

Years ago I had the pleasure of sitting in on one of his talks on longevity. Other than the casual racism and sexism (Watson is the only person in my entire life I've seen say racist things about Irish people), he made a big comment on Linus Pauling's obsession towards the end of his life regarding Vitamin C consumption. The main idea is that primates such as humans and chimps lost the ability to synthesize vitamin C…

Linus Pauling's obsession with Vitamin C is a famous case of an accomplished scientist getting sidetracked with baseless medical quackery. Even during his lifetime there were clinical trials including by the Mayo Clinic that failed to support his claims, but he rejected them all because he was convinced he was right and they were wrong.

Linus Pauling was also famously in favor of eugenics directed at African Americans, proposing things like compulsory sickle cell anemia testing for African Americans and forehead tattoos for carriers of the sickle cell gene. So maybe not a surprise that James Watson would vibe with Linus Pauling's legacy.

Re: James Watson has died

#86

Post by krapp »

efilife wrote: post #82
JKCalhoun wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wow, good genes! Said with irony? I mean, the guy was into eugenics—thought some races are smarter than others.

But isn't this true? Asians are proven to have the highest IQ

No.

Race isn't biological, it's a social and political construct. The social and political construct known as "Asians" comprises about 60% of the global population. Also, IQ is not a measure of intelligence.

There are cultural reasons why some people in some "Asian" countries may do better on average in academics, such as stronger familial bonds, peer pressure and a greater cultural value placed on scholastic achievement, but that's far from proof that "Asians" are genetically and intellectually superior to other races, much less that therefore eugenics (and by extension the white supremacist ideology it was created to normalize, which ironically considered "Asians" to be subhuman) is "proven true."

Re: James Watson has died

#87

Post by Aurornis »

sharadov wrote: post #39

Wasn't his partner Crick high on LSD when he discovered the double-helix structure of DNA?

Last time I checked, this was basically folklore. There were some allusions to Francis Crick experimenting with LSD, but their DNA work predates that.

Psychedelic proponents like to claim that LSD helped Francis Crick discover the double helix, but every time I go looking for a source it's a circular web of references and articles that cite each other or, at best, claim that Crick mentioned to a friend that LSD helped him.

Re: James Watson has died

#88

Post by n4r9 »

dekhn wrote: post #47
echelon wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're probably thinking about Mullis, inventor of PCR [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kary_Mullis

No, Mullis wrote the Nature paper on time reversal due to the LSD trip ( https://www.nature.com/articles/218663b0 )

From the Wikipedia page

> During a symposium held for centenarian Albert Hofmann, Hofmann said Mullis had told him that LSD had "helped him develop the polymerase chain reaction that helps amplify specific DNA sequences".

Re: James Watson has died

#89

Post by aerostable_slug »

LarsDu88 wrote: post #71

Years ago I had the pleasure of sitting in on one of his talks on longevity. Other than the casual racism and sexism (Watson is the only person in my entire life I've seen say racist things about Irish people), he made a big comment on Linus Pauling's obsession towards the end of his life regarding Vitamin C consumption. The main idea is that primates such as humans and chimps lost the ability to synthesize vitamin C…

> racist things about Irish people

It's a trait that some people of Irish descent, like Watson, share.

See also: self-deprecating humor Greek, Jewish, Italian, and members of other ethnicities are sometimes known for. The difference is that Watson just didn't care to read the room before letting loose.

Re: James Watson has died

#90

Post by aerostable_slug »

culi wrote: post #58
flkiwi wrote: post #38

[flagged]

Watson was the one who described Franklin as "belligerent, emotional, and unable to interpret her own data" in his book. He also repeatedly referred to her as "Rosy", a name Franklin never used. Wilkins was the one who showed Franklin's Photograph 51 to Watson. This was without Franklin's consent and before her photographs were officially published. Watson and Crick then rushed to publish their findings before Frankl…

No, they rushed to beat Pauling. In a just world Franklin would gotten a co-author credit, but I don't think anyone holds that she was going to have the breakthrough on her own.
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