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Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

supercarblondie.com

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Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#301

Post by Timon3 »

schiffern wrote: post #227
ehnto wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you however I believe weight and safety are in a complex relationship right now, which has nothing to do with performance and handling. Unfortunately I feel much less safe in a Fiat 500 when a significant portion of cars in the road weigh nearly 3 tonnes and perhaps can't even see me. I suspect most people are in SUVs because they're the pragmatic trade off between safety and convenience, not because the…

Classic prisoner's dilemma. Everyone who can will naturally choose "defect" unless there's some sort of external coordination mechanism.

Not everyone, but far too many.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#302

Post by mulmen »

UnserMannInK wrote: post #254
thesz wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla Model Y's battery is 771 kg. The motor in Model Y weights about 45 kg, about three times as much as the motor in the article. By reducing dual motor configuration weight from 90 kg to 28 kg, we reduce total powertrain weight by 7%.

And shouldn’t it be possible to make the battery smaller with a more efficient motor?

The battery could be made smaller by whatever amount is needed to carry the marginal motor weight the advertised distance.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#303

Post by gambiting »

ajuc wrote: post #286
gambiting wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A basic BMW 5 series is over 2 tonnes, with the top spec model tipping the scales at 2.5 tonnes. I mean I agree with the general sentiment but it's not just SUVs that need to go on a diet. Everything is getting heavier and heavier and heavier.

yeah, the tax should be based on car weight per passanger

That will just make the gigantic SUVs with 7 or more seats dominate even more.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#304

Post by GenerWork »

Lio wrote: post #267
Aurornis wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. EV motors are already lightweight. The electric motor in a vehicle like a Tesla Model 3 already weighs less than you do. Reducing that one component by 75% would be a weight savings equivalent to about a half of a passenger. Not a significant effic…

Not a game changer but I wonder if ligher motors allow you to do things like have one motor per drive wheel, removing the need for differential gearboxes? Then you can do clever things with traction control without having to use the ABS system to brake the drive wheels. Or dramatically change the turning circle on big cars and vans. Maybe even reduce the size and weight of the braking system by taking on some of that…

I believe that some EVs already have 1 motor per wheel such as the top of the line Rivians that are advertised as quad motor.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#305

Post by throw-qqqqq »

jabl wrote: post #272
throw-qqqqq wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably know already, but ICE cars only convert about 20–30% of fuel energy into motion, while EVs are often +90% efficient. So when an EV has to work harder (extra battery weight or colder weather), you notice the drop in range more. In an ICE, the same load is less visible because most energy gets wasted as heat. This is also why cold weather seems to affect EV range more.

> You probably know already, but ICE cars only convert about 20–30% of fuel energy into motion, while EVs are often +90% efficient. So when an EV has to work harder (extra battery weight or colder weather), you notice the drop in range more. There's a kernel of truth here in that Otto engines suffer lower efficiency at part load, however I suspect the real reason is that gas car range is "good enough" and refilling i…

> That's because a) some batteries suffer degraded performance at low temperature, and b) ICE cars use the plentiful waste heat for cabin heating whereas an EV needs a heat pump or even resistive heating of the cabin air.

You are making my point here actually. Combustion engines suffer from the exact same, but because they waste so much energy as heat already, less “extra” energy needs to be spent on that.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#306

Post by whamlastxmas »

catapart wrote: post #261
Aurornis wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. EV motors are already lightweight. The electric motor in a vehicle like a Tesla Model 3 already weighs less than you do. Reducing that one component by 75% would be a weight savings equivalent to about a half of a passenger. Not a significant effic…

It drops a buck fifty per motor . That IS a game changer. It can make cars cheaper, or longer range, or faster, or any number of other designs based on what the manufacturer is looking for. But to OP's point about flight - stacking 6 Tesla motors is not an option. Stacking 6 of these YASA motors? Much less weight.

Range in EVs is impacted very little by weight

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#307

Post by ajuc »

gambiting wrote: post #303
ajuc wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah, the tax should be based on car weight per passanger

That will just make the gigantic SUVs with 7 or more seats dominate even more.

car weight / min(number of seats, number of people in the family)

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#308

Post by lunias »

neya wrote: post #253
lunias wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience... it really does compound unlike any other change that you can make to a vehicle. IMO heavy vehicles are a scam and the antithesis of the direction we should be moving.

> I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience This is a blanket statement and completely untrue. Good driving experience is directly correlated to TRACTION, not just weight. And traction isn't just a function of weight - it also is affected by center of gravity, friction between the wheels and the road. Traction is what gives you the perc…

I get what you're saying, but tire technology has improved traction so greatly in the last decade that we can definitely take the slight loss in maximum theoretical traction for the massive benefits in other areas. There is also the question of what "maximum traction" is... what scenario are we talking about? Straight line acceleration from a dig or skidpad turning at a high speed? If we're turning at all then the momentum (which increases w/ mass) of the vehicle is what pulls it off course and causes the tires to break traction.

I also drive a FWD (a quite spicy one) and I break traction all the time, not because of weight, but because of torque. You can modulate torque, not weight. The biggest traction increases that I made on my FWD were when I put on sticky summer tires, the second was subtly changing front control arm geometry and bushings, and the third was adding stiffer engine mounts.

Agreed on getting tossed around in a light car though, not much can be done about that... other than making the roads better and lowering the center of gravity.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#309

Post by UnserMannInK »

thesz wrote: post #268
UnserMannInK wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And shouldn’t it be possible to make the battery smaller with a more efficient motor?

It is not indicated anywhere that this particular motor is more efficient than older ones in terms of the electric force conversion. This new motor is more powerful, that's it. Nothing was said about cooling or voltage requirements. The latter is important because higher voltage is more dangerous to work with or be near.

Ah ok, that makes sense

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#310

Post by Enginerrrd »

hvb2 wrote: post #265
Enginerrrd wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From Wikipedia on Axial Flux Motors: >"Mercedes-Benz subsidiary YASA (Yokeless and Segmented Armature) makes AFMs that have powered various concept (Jaguar C-X75), prototype, and racing vehicles. It was also used in the Koenigsegg Regera, the Ferrari SF90 Stradale and S96GTB, Lamborghini Revuelto hybrid and the Lola-Drayson.[9] The company is investigating the potential for placing motors inside wheels, given that AF…

The fact that you CAN put it in the wheel doesn't mean it MUST to go in the wheel.

Yes but the wikipedia article is referencing YASA, the company in the featured article.
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