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My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

michael.stapelberg.ch

71–80 of 417 posts

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#71

It's classic Apple to spend over a decade insisting that that glossy screens were the best option, and then to eventually roll out a matte screen as a "premium" feature with a bunch of marketing around it.

Historically, traditional matte screen finishes exhibited poor optical qualities by scattering ambient light, which tended to wash out colors. This scattering process also affected the light from individual pixels, causing it to refract into neighboring pixels. This reduced overall image quality and caused pixel-fine details, such as small text, to appear smeary on high-density LCDs. In contrast, well-designed glossy…

I used to have a 2006 macbook pro with the matte screen. It was glorious. None of these issues were present or really noticeable. Maybe you'd notice it in lab setting but not irl. Kind of like 120hz and 4k; just useless to most peoples eyes at the distances people actually use these devices. I've only owned matte external monitors as well and again, no issues there.

The glossy era macbooks otoh have been a disaster in comparison imo. Unless your room is pitch black it is so easy to get external reflections. Using it outside sucks, you often see yourself more clearly than the actual contents on the screen. Little piece of dust on the screen you flick off becomes a fingerprint smear. The actual opening of the lid on the new thin bezel models means the top edge is never free of fingerprints. I'm inside right now and this M3 pro is on max brightness setting just to make it you know, usable, inside. I'm not sure if my screen is actually defectively dim or this is just how it is. Outside it is just barely bright enough to make out the screen. Really not much better than my old 2012 non retina model in terms of outdoor viewing which is a bit of a disappointment because the marketing material lead me to believe these new macbooks are extremely bright. I guess for HDR content maybe that is true but not for 99% of use cases.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#72
post #20

Incredible hardware. Love that I can also run local llms on mine. https://github.com/Aider-AI/aider/issues/4526

But are these llms worth their salt?

They're not unless you curve the grading because they're running locally.

Which some people do, but I don't think the average person asking this question does (and I don't)

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#73

It's classic Apple to spend over a decade insisting that that glossy screens were the best option, and then to eventually roll out a matte screen as a "premium" feature with a bunch of marketing around it.

i recently worked with a macbook pro and it caused uncomfortable feelings of eyestrain. i had some app that was supposed to disable the temporal dithering but i'm not sure if it helped. i'm curious if there's anyone else on here like me who has experienced eyestrain with macbooks where the nano texture display has helped.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#74
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's classic Apple to spend over a decade insisting that that glossy screens were the best option I don't recall Apple ever "insisting" anything about glossy vs. matte. They simply eliminated the matte option without comment, and finally brought it back many years later. If you have a reference to a public statement from Apple defending the elimination of the matte option, I'd like to see it. To be clear, I've been…

> They simply eliminated the matte option without comment, and finally brought it back many years later. Wasn’t the matte option that disappeared just then removing the glass in front of the screen? I seem to remember that (my MBP from that time was glossy). The nano textured coating they are using now is quite complex and I am not quite sure it was applicable at such scales cheaply enough back in 2015.

The PowerBook and the first MacBook Pro were only matte.

A glossy option was introduced in 2006, but the MacBook Pro was still matte by default.

In 2008, the MacBook Pro case was redesigned, and then the display situation changed significantly.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#75

> I still don’t like macOS and would prefer to run Linux on this laptop. But Asahi Linux still needs some work before it’s usable for me (I need external display output, and M4 support). This doesn’t bother me too much, though, as I don’t use this computer for serious work. “I don’t use this computer for serious work.” Dropped $3K on MBP to play around with. Definitely should have gotten MBA

He lives in Switzerland. $3K barely pays for a lunch and an espresso.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> High-quality glass glossy displays are often easy to use even in full daylight, I guess Apple cheaped out on their glossy displays, because I definitely didn't care for mine in full daylight

Glossy vs matte has started to matter less as the peak brightness goes up. When your screen can do 1,600 nits, daylight isn't as much of a problem

Yeah this m3 pro isn't really doing 1600 nits. Marginally brighter than my 2012.

To get to actual 1600 nits you need to use scripts.

https://github.com/SerjoschDuering/macbook_1600nits

Not sure the impacts to display health or battery running the screen full bore like this.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#77
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you prefer glossy paper work? glossy book pages? glossy construction documents? The preference for a non-reflective surface for the relaying of dense information has been established for decades. You know what's glossy? Movie posters and postcards.

non-reflective surfaces you cite have pigments on TOP. screens have depth causing parallax and light spreading. Your point would be valid if screens were paper-thin and image pixels came out the very surface

You'd need a jewelers loupe to appreciate parallax and spreading. Not a real problem in general use.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#78
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historically, traditional matte screen finishes exhibited poor optical qualities by scattering ambient light, which tended to wash out colors. This scattering process also affected the light from individual pixels, causing it to refract into neighboring pixels. This reduced overall image quality and caused pixel-fine details, such as small text, to appear smeary on high-density LCDs. In contrast, well-designed glossy…

I used to have a 2006 macbook pro with the matte screen. It was glorious. None of these issues were present or really noticeable. Maybe you'd notice it in lab setting but not irl. Kind of like 120hz and 4k; just useless to most peoples eyes at the distances people actually use these devices. I've only owned matte external monitors as well and again, no issues there. The glossy era macbooks otoh have been a disaster i…

To each their own but I have a matte M4 Pro and I don't like it, and the screen is noticeably worse than my glossy M2 Pro.

There's a graininess to the screen that makes it feel a little worse at all times, meanwhile I never had a problem in daylight just cranking brightness into the XDR range using Lunar.

It's especially noticeable on light UIs, where empty space gets an RGB "sparkle" to it. I noticed the same thing when picking out my XDR years ago, so it seems like they never figured out how to solve it.

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#79
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

non-reflective surfaces you cite have pigments on TOP. screens have depth causing parallax and light spreading. Your point would be valid if screens were paper-thin and image pixels came out the very surface

You'd need a jewelers loupe to appreciate parallax and spreading. Not a real problem in general use.

i use a matte screen protector on my iphone. without it, i can see pixels. with it, i cannot. no loupe, just my nearsighted eyes

Re: My Impressions of the MacBook Pro M4

#80
I still have a 2019 MacBook Pro with the non-butterfly keyboard and escape key (unfortunately still the Touch Bar).

It’s still a great laptop except the battery lasts maybe 75 mins. I just keep it plugged in but despite the fact it’s 6 years old I don’t notice any problems with it.

I’m tempted to buy an M4 laptop just because it’s “new” and “faster” but then I ask myself Why? It’s the same thing with my iPhone. Until my laptop dies or there is something functional that I can’t do with my old laptop I’m going to keep using it.

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